terminal-boredom.com
Terminal Boardumb => Non-Music Shit => Topic started by: Erin S on December 01, 2012, 04:22:35 PM
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I live in a small-ish city in Indiana, where there isn't a whole lot to besides go to bars. I also work 3rd shift, so staying out late at a bar is kind of a moot point anyway. There were more, better shows when I 16-18 here, now there are some but they're more few and far between. I stopped drinking in August for health reasons, and I'm finding it harder and harder to maintain friendships. Most of 'em are gone.
Creative ideas welcome.
Or maybe I just need to move somewhere completely different.
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I don't think there are any easy answers to this. Find a hobby that you enjoy and try meditation or something similar to relieve the stress. Longest I've made it sober so far is one month. But it was a memorable, fulfilling and productive month. I'm going to do it again in February and take a month off drinking once a year. Or so I say.
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Don't move to Brooklyn.
I'm drunk.
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I agree with you, I definitely need a hobby. The trouble is that we don't have a ton of money right now, and it's the middle of December in Indiana. In the summer I go horseback riding, which is a great stress reliever. Suggestions welcome. I agree that there are no easy answers. I've lost 15 pounds since I stopped drinking, which is pretty rewarding in and of itself - I weigh the same now as I did in 9th grade. I guess I can always start crocheting or cross-stitching just to complete the old-lady image.
We're looking into moving to a bigger city (Indianapolis) in the next 1-2 years, so hopefully there there will be more opportunities for alcohol-free good times. I live in West Lafayette currently. Home of Purdue University and not much else.
Brooklyn's too far away for me, I would get home sick. I totally see the appeal, but I'm too much of a wimp to live 1-2 hours driving distance from my family.
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Chicago's also up in the air as a possibility, depending on if my husband could find a job easily if I could get an IL nursing license, and how well Chicago pays RNs.
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My area of expertise! I've either been pregnant or breastfeeding for the last year and a half so I've got the non-drinking social life down. Here's how I have fun without bars:
1.) Potlucks - If money is tight offer to host and you usually end up with tons of yummy leftovers. Discussed in greater detail here: http://terminal-boredom.com/forums/index.php?topic=19705.0
2.) Fancy dinner night - invite people over for a fancy dinner. We're friends with a couple who do this every Sunday and have had us over for an awesome homemade Indian feast.
3.) Games / cards night - Euchre for me
4.) Go to yoga class - Feels good physically but also feels good to get out the house and be around people. Or just go to the gym or whatever. YMCA memberships are usually super cheap. Most towns though have a community yoga class that's 5 bucks or less.
5.) Bad TV night - I don't have cable so I go over to a girl friend's house at least once a month to catch up on bad tv together.
I have moved a lot and in my experience things are just about the same wherever I go. Although when I first move somewhere it's usually harder because I have to start from scratch making friends and stuff.
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Abstained from drinking and smoking for about a month recently. I became reclusive. I spent my nights reading, watching movies and writing. I found no joy in playing music or watching bands. I found joy in listening to records by myself. I only met with friends for coffee. I avoided bars, because let's face it: if you're not drinking, bars are boring. So, too, is socializing. For the most part. For me.
I got shit done. With the money I usually blew on boozing, I paid outstanding debts, bought material possessions that made me happy.
I looked healthier. Others called attention to it. I ate three square meals a day. Fruits and vegetables. And a lot of candy bars, because the body misses that sugar.
I wasn't lonely at all. I wasn't dating, really, but I'd been seeing a girl in her early 20s. She would come to my house, hang out for a bit, have a few beers, listen to my records, then leave the next morning. The last time I saw her, she put a finger in my chest and insisted I take her out. "OK," I said. Then I wrote her off.
I loved being sober. I wasn't tempted in the least, not even at my place of work, which is a bar & restaurant. (As an aside, working without a hangover made the job much more tolerable.)
Then I went on a week-long tour, and on the second night: back to zero. Curiously, playing music became fun again. The connection was not lost. What horseshit.
I go days without drinks now, and when I do drink, it doesn't do much for me. The ritual's no longer exciting or beautiful or profanely "sacred"; the hangovers, too dismal; the social interactions, largely disposable or uninteresting, save for those moments when I connect with close friends I don't see very often. The distortions of a bender are no longer telling of any larger picture, and they no longer amplify otherwise banal occurrences -- they're just cheap funhouse exaggerations of the dull and dreary.
I suspect that I'll quit drinking entirely within the next five years, if not sooner.
I think the key to maintaining a healthy social life while sober is to pursue your interests, assuming your interests are socially compatible. I'm just not a very social person when I'm away from drink. I become wholly solipsistic, which is quite fine by me. There's something to be said about being unavailable.
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Yeah, but we got drunk though, huh...
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Boy, did we! And it was a blast. No regrets.
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there was a night last summer when i didnt drink. just a couple weeks ago i took a night off from drinking. other than those two occasions i literally cannot remember the last time i did not drink at least a twelve pack of beer nightly. i would say i average about four sober days a year for the last 15 years or so.
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My area of expertise! I've either been pregnant or breastfeeding for the last year and a half so I've got the non-drinking social life down. Here's how I have fun without bars:
1.) Potlucks - If money is tight offer to host and you usually end up with tons of yummy leftovers. Discussed in greater detail here: http://terminal-boredom.com/forums/index.php?topic=19705.0
2.) Fancy dinner night - invite people over for a fancy dinner. We're friends with a couple who do this every Sunday and have had us over for an awesome homemade Indian feast.
3.) Games / cards night - Euchre for me
4.) Go to yoga class - Feels good physically but also feels good to get out the house and be around people. Or just go to the gym or whatever. YMCA memberships are usually super cheap. Most towns though have a community yoga class that's 5 bucks or less.
5.) Bad TV night - I don't have cable so I go over to a girl friend's house at least once a month to catch up on bad tv together.
I have moved a lot and in my experience things are just about the same wherever I go. Although when I first move somewhere it's usually harder because I have to start from scratch making friends and stuff.
I love the idea of taking a yoga class, because it would probably help my back pain as well. I have two herniated discs and need surgery, but I don't have health insurance.
The trouble is, I don't really have any friends in this town anymore. I had meningitis last year (which caused my spinal issues) and was in the hospital for a long time. It's been a year almost to the day since that happened, and I can count on one hand the number of times I've had any sort of social interaction with a friend. The person I thought was my best friend in Lafayette won't answer my calls or texts. Actually, basically ever since I had my kid (who's 3 now) I've gradually lost friends and, well, it sucks. And like I said, I work 3rd shift, which basically limits my social life 5/7 days of the week to anything before 9:30. Which no one is into.
I have satellite, a nice house, and a nice kitchen. I like the idea of having a potluck or a fancy dinner night, but I don't think anyone here would bother coming. Like I said before, living in a small town like Lafayette, everything revolves around drinking and/or going to bars. Because there's not much else to do. I do know of a community center that offers a cheap yoga class, I think I'm going to sign up.
Bottom line is: I think I need to move. Which sucks, because I grew up here, my whole family is here, and I rely on them for A LOT. Anytime I need a last-minute babysitter I know I can count on my mom, who lives 4 minutes away from me. I don't want to move, really, but I also don't want to spend the rest of my life here as a complete hermit. I'd like to be able to hang out with people who have similar interests as mine who I can listen to records with, but it's just not happening.
Today my husband told me that no one in Lafayette likes me because I come off as "erratic and weird," which I don't think is true. I don't know if he was just trying to fuck with me, but that really stung. I think I'll just quit now, I don't want to be accused (again) of "whining a lot.
*Addendum: I have no desire to drink, so that's not even part of the issue.
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I would actually love to throw a Christmas party at my house, but I don't think it would go over well. People would just be pissed off that there wasn't booze there.
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there was a night last summer when i didnt drink. just a couple weeks ago i took a night off from drinking. other than those two occasions i literally cannot remember the last time i did not drink at least a twelve pack of beer nightly. i would say i average about four sober days a year for the last 15 years or so.
This really isn't good Mr Officer Brad X.
I rarely drink...I'm the total lightweight who gets loaded after 3 beers...and I intend to keep it that way.
Its great on the wallet, waistline and brain.
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I was up to a 12 pack a day too...just like officer bradxxx.....time to get over it bro. You are going to die from that shit. Is it really worth it? How much Natty Ice does one man need?? Check yo self before you wreck yo self
I've found a lot of stuff to do thru AA. You don't even hafta have a problem to attend...all you need is an interest in doing something besides drinking. It's free too! I've made a bunch of new friends and we do sober stuff all the time. I've been off the sauce for 9 months now and plan on keeping it up. Drinking was just quieting my brain...I was self medicating. Now my time is clear...my head is clear...my friendships are clear...I'm a better dad and boyfriend...life is just better. Maybe give it a shot?? Or read a little of the Big Book?
I still go to bars and shows occasionally but it's different being "sober" (can't go without nuggz) I get to watch people make asses of themselves instead of being that ass hat. I get weird looks from the bartender when I ask for an O'Douls....I usually end up paying for 1 or 2 and the tender usually gives me the rest for nothing. I get to enjoy comments from my drunken friends about how happy they are for me and how healthy I am. And the best part is I get to be DD. Can't lose any friends and I know they are safe with me driving sober.
I think Yoga is a good idea...so is reading and meditation. Read Dr. John Sarno's book on back pain while you're at it. And keep on listening to tunes alone!! Who gives a shit. Or invite a drunk friend over to listen with you
I live in a tiny town without much to do but drink (it seems) so it's a bit of a challenge at times. But I seem to always pull thru.
And...Erin, tell your hubby what he said isn't cool. You don't need that...he should realize it pretty easily
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Serve booze. Just don't drink any.
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I just sent out invitations on Facebook for a Christmas party on the 15th... I hope enough people will come so it's not just 2-3 people hanging out awkwardly. My husband's a chef so he's gonna do all the cooking, and I encouraged people to bring dishes too. I'll be playing records and taking pictures. Hopefully this will work out, I'm kind of excited, I've wanted to throw a Christmas party for years but never got around to it. I'll probably send the kid to my mom's house since he's at the age where he's into everything.
Much thanks to those who gave good ideas.
Tina - I tried looking up local yoga classes online at our community center, but all I could find where ones from the Fall. I guess I'll have to keep looking. There's got to be something out there.
As an aside - another reason I stopped drinking was that alcoholism runs in my mom's side of the family. Her mom is still alive (somehow), and she still drinks a box of wine a day, and smokes. Her husband, who was a fucking anesthesiologist died a very bad, painful death of liver failure in his early 60s.
I don't think my husband was trying to be "mean," he's just not very good at sugar-coating things. Even before he said that I knew I'd fallen out of touch with almost all my friends.
In July of his year I was driving home from my brother's birthday and got pulled over for having a turn signal out. I tested 0.01 above the legal limit and went to jail. That was another reason I quit drinking. Luckily, my step-dad's a lawyer and I didn't get much besides a shit-load of fines and 30 hours of community service. The big deal is, I'm going to have to declare this to the nursing board next October. I won't lose my RN license, but it's made it harder to find jobs. Before that happened, the only trouble I'd ever been in was getting a speeding ticket.
It's just not worth it to be anymore. I have a lot of health problems, and I know alcohol is just going to make them worse. Of course a glass of wine every now and then ain't gonna kill you, but I just have no desire to drink anymore.
My husband is also a severe alcoholic who's in AA, so I feel like a complete hypocrite when I drink.
Meshkalina - Good advice. I'm throwing a Christmas party on the 15th and am planning to make some kind of punch with booze in it. I'm sure no one will come anyway if there isn't alcohol to be had.
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Christmas Party at Erin's!!!! :)
Alcoholism runs in my family too. I'm glad I'm stopping the cycle at me....it can be a rough way to die.
(morbid)
BradXXX- Aren't you about 60 now? You should stop drinking while you still have your youth
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I would second Asshole Face's recommendation of AA for places to meet non-drinkers socially. A lot of the people you'd meet in AA, are the same kind of people you'd meet partying (duh), but it's now a part of their lifestyle to help others find things to do without booze. Also a good chance the people a person would meet there may be more accepting of any personal idiosyncrasies a person might have. Plus, if addiction runs on your mom's side of your family, and exists in your home, it may wind up being therapeutic for you.
The main thing is to find the right meeting, and the right people. It can take a little work, but maybe your husband might have some advice/recommendations. I'd just avoid his meetings, but he's probably been to a lot of different ones if he's working the program and might know ones that may be the most beneficial.
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Then I went on a week-long tour, and on the second night: back to zero. Curiously, playing music became fun again. The connection was not lost. What horseshit.
congrats to managing to stay sober at Class, not an easy accomplishment
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I would second Asshole Face's recommendation of AA for places to meet non-drinkers socially. A lot of the people you'd meet in AA, are the same kind of people you'd meet partying (duh), but it's now a part of their lifestyle to help others find things to do without booze. Also a good chance the people a person would meet there may be more accepting of any personal idiosyncrasies a person might have. Plus, if addiction runs on your mom's side of your family, and exists in your home, it may wind up being therapeutic for you.
The main thing is to find the right meeting, and the right people. It can take a little work, but maybe your husband might have some advice/recommendations. I'd just avoid his meetings, but he's probably been to a lot of different ones if he's working the program and might know ones that may be the most beneficial.
Good call! It took me months to find the right meeting. I only go once a week but it really fills me up for the rest of the week. And I really do find people there that are more accepting of my oddness and awkwardness. I think going by yourself at first is a good idea too. Sponsors can be good friends too...assuming you find someone you look up to and is interested in your sobriety.
A lot of meetings are men or women specific....maybe that's a way to search out a good one. Also, I've found some are a little more God oriented than I appreciate. But oddly enough the one I like the best is at a church.
Erin....there are meetings at all hours of the day. 6 AM - 9 PM here. Maybe you'll find people on the same schedule as you that have similar interests. Also don't worry about the trouble you got into. I doubt it will make much of a difference when you need a job or certification...especial ly considering it's your only offense. Everyone fucks up. DUI's are one of the most common fuck ups for people our age. Don't stress it. I bet a lot of others are in the exact same position as you
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You can always meet people on the internet. Put an ad on craigslist and watch you inbox flood with replies! Everyone wants to be your friend, or show you their dick, but maybe that's the same thing.
I like having disposable internet friends because I can just use the same conversation over and over.
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I think Al-Anon or however you spell it would be a really good idea for me. It's basically the same format as AA, but it's designed for people with family members that struggle with alcoholism. I'm going to do a Google search right now to see if there are any meetings in my town coming soon. I went to an AA meeting with my husband a few weeks ago, and a lot of the women there suggested I go to Al-Anon. I think it's a really good idea.
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I think Al-Anon or however you spell it would be a really good idea for me. It's basically the same format as AA, but it's designed for people with family members that struggle with alcoholism. I'm going to do a Google search right now to see if there are any meetings in my town coming soon. I went to an AA meeting with my husband a few weeks ago, and a lot of the women there suggested I go to Al-Anon. I think it's a really good idea.
me too!! Either is a good idea
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As an aside, I just called Goodwill and signed up to do my 30 hours of community service there. I'm doing it in 4 hour chunks. Has anyone on here ever volunteered on Goodwill? I'm not expecting it to be hard labor or anything, but it wasn't my first choice. Basically the only reason I called them is because I can walk there in 15 minutes from my house. I really wanted to do my community service at the animal shelter (I'm sick of humans), but they didn't have any spots available. By the end of the week I'll have 20 out of my 30 hours of community service done, which is encouraging.
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Yeah, I've done a lot of "volunteering" at Goodwill. Even if you are disabled, you can work there.
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By the end of the week I'll have 20 out of my 30 hours of community service done, which is encouraging.
nice!!
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Yeah, I've done a lot of "volunteering" at Goodwill. Even if you are disabled, you can work there.
Yeah, I remember you mentioning that once. I'm not expecting it to be hard, just tedious. They have a "dress code," I have to wear khaki pants, and a solid black, blue, or white shirt.
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I've grown sick of drinking lately so I quit and feel better. Can't really say I'll never drink again, I don't really know.
I play music and I don't feel like being sober has made it any worse to do. Touring might be hard, I don't know. Even gigging might be but I don't know yet because, ironically, a bandmate of mine is having to take some time off due to alcohol related legal issues. I guess we'll see when he returns or we have to replace him, or whatever is going to happen. I'm 46 so I don't really get any pressure from the 20-30 somethings I hang out with to drink anyway. I think I act about the same either way too, but I was starting to feel a bit "wet brained" when I drank; like I was going to say or do something I wouldn't want to. Overall, I feel like the social interactions haven't changed.
But, I live in a big city and there's plenty of gigs to go and be social at. That obviously is a problem for you.
I'm a workaholic, though, so I can only really do anything if it is "work" as opposed to "relaxation". That's why I play in bands and pretty much only go out to gigs. Fuck, I hate relaxation.
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... but I was starting to feel a bit "wet brained" when I drank; like I was going to say or do something I wouldn't want to.
me too....I didn't have a last "drunk" because of this. Just a drink or two and that feeling was overwhelming. I had to stop asap
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I have an interview coming up at a psychiatric hospital for a part-time position. If they offer me the position I'll probably take it, along with my full-time job at a nursing home. More money, plus I'll be busier. I'm kind of a workaholic too, and I need to stay busy.
Whenever we DO get decent shows in Lafayette,, it's always at a bar. I miss when Downtown Records was still around - it was a good venue.
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I have an interview coming up at a psychiatric hospital for a part-time position.
Maybe you can do your other 10 hours there? They might even have AA meetings there that you could set up or sit in on. H & I work is good for the soul :)
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I have an interview coming up at a psychiatric hospital for a part-time position.
Maybe you can do your other 10 hours there? They might even have AA meetings there that you could set up or sit in on. H & I work is good for the soul :)
H & I = Hospitals and Institutions
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I like non-bar venues for gigs too.
Man, that whole "wet brained" thing scares me. I've never even really been that big of a drinker for most of my life. I think it's just a part of getting old; I don't know.
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I like non-bar venues for gigs too.
Man, that whole "wet brained" thing scares me. I've never even really been that big of a drinker for most of my life. I think it's just a part of getting old; I don't know.
Scares the shit out of me too. I "only" drank for ten years. I dunno that I really went as hard as some people (I've heard plenty of "bottom" stories that I just don't relate to) but my brain was a mess any way. Thankful everyday that I don't drink. Recovery is slow but does progress if you pay attention and let it do so
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I like non-bar venues for gigs too.
Man, that whole "wet brained" thing scares me. I've never even really been that big of a drinker for most of my life. I think it's just a part of getting old; I don't know.
When I was in nursing school I took care of a patient who that. It's called Korsakoff's Syndrome (I probably spelled that wrong). this was a lady in her late 40s/early 50s who didn't even know why she was in the hospital. First she thought it was because she had a baby. She kept yelling for us to give her her baby back. The next day she thought she was there because she had her appendix taken out. I'll never forget that.
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I like non-bar venues for gigs too.
Man, that whole "wet brained" thing scares me. I've never even really been that big of a drinker for most of my life. I think it's just a part of getting old; I don't know.
When I was in nursing school I took care of a patient who that. It's called Korsakoff's Syndrome (I probably spelled that wrong). this was a lady in her late 40s/early 50s who didn't even know why she was in the hospital. First she thought it was because she had a baby. She kept yelling for us to give her her baby back. The next day she thought she was there because she had her appendix taken out. I'll never forget that.
oh fuck....that's scary!
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I like non-bar venues for gigs too.
Man, that whole "wet brained" thing scares me. I've never even really been that big of a drinker for most of my life. I think it's just a part of getting old; I don't know.
When I was in nursing school I took care of a patient who that. It's called Korsakoff's Syndrome (I probably spelled that wrong). this was a lady in her late 40s/early 50s who didn't even know why she was in the hospital. First she thought it was because she had a baby. She kept yelling for us to give her her baby back. The next day she thought she was there because she had her appendix taken out. I'll never forget that.
oh fuck....that's scary!
that's one of those "bottoms" I never want to get to. Thank god
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Damn, talk about scared straight?
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Damn, talk about scared straight?
word
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Me and my husband have been talking casually about moving to Indianapolis in the next year, and I think I'm going to do it. I have no reason to stay here anymore. Lafayette was fun when I was 18, but it's gradually lost its appeal to me. I HATE the thought of being away from my family, but I also hate living an essentially solitary life. My husband's from Indianapolis so he really wants to move back. I'm basically fed up with the people here; people that I used to consider my friends but that now pretend that I don't even exist. I'm not sure if this would have happened if I'd stopped going to bars or not.
Maybe this is everywhere, but there's somewhat of a double standard here - if you're a girl, getting wasted makes you look sloppy and erratic. If you're a guy, it doesn't seem like it's that big of a deal. Maybe that's just me imagining things, but sometimes it seems that way.
No offense to those that suggested it, but I don't like the idea of going to AA meetings because I don't consider myself an alcoholic and never have. When I got pulled over I hadn't had a drink in probably 6-7 months. I've been to AA meetings with my husband before, and I can tell that they're not right for me.
Sorry for bitching so much about this, it's just a miserable situation all around that I honestly think boils down to one fact - that I need to move somewhere else.
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i grew up in the AA clubhouse for a number of years, its also not for me. i hate people in general, especially the dry drunk type who chainsmoke and drink coffee nonstop and try to outdo each other with tales of the past. churches are full of assholes, and AA is like a church.
fuck the twelve steps.
We admitted we were powerless over alcohol - that our lives had become unmanageable.
Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
Continued to take personal inventory, and when we were wrong, promptly admitted it.
Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.
Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
no fucking thanks.
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^ agreed.
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step one is already bullshit. okay, so i am powerless. i am a victim. a demonic presence inside me is forcing me to drink, and i am powerless to stop on my own. i no longer bear the responsibility for my own actions. now what?
step two, a power greater than myself will restore me? magic sky man is real? horseshit! i do not and will not believe that, so now what?
step three - turn my life and my will over to something which all common sense tells me does not exist? thats impossible.
therefore the idea of turning oneself over to god to remove all shortcomings and and defects of character is likewise impossible.
doing a moral inventory of yourself and striving to rectify any hurt you have done to others should be a daily part of life whether you are an alcoholic or not.
i guess if some people can be cured by belief in an imaginary god and group dynamic, good for them. to me, half the 12 steps are what i would call "god bullshit" and the other half are common sense.
what is amazingly missing from the 12 steps is "stop drinking" but i guess its impossible to exercise free will when you have a "disease" and are by ourselves "powerless over alcohol."
without belief in a higher power to turn your life and your will over to, the rest is worthless. step one declares you powerless over alcohol, so unless you can accept that and have some sort of god to help you, the 12 step program is useless.
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i grew up in the AA clubhouse for a number of years, its also not for me. i hate people in general, especially the dry drunk type who chainsmoke and drink coffee nonstop and try to outdo each other with tales of the past. churches are full of assholes, and AA is like a church.
fuck the twelve steps.
We admitted we were powerless over alcohol - that our lives had become unmanageable.
Came to believe that a Power greater than ourselves could restore us to sanity.
Made a decision to turn our will and our lives over to the care of God as we understood Him.
Made a searching and fearless moral inventory of ourselves.
Admitted to God, to ourselves, and to another human being the exact nature of our wrongs.
Were entirely ready to have God remove all these defects of character.
Humbly asked Him to remove our shortcomings.
Made a list of all persons we had harmed, and became willing to make amends to them all.
Made direct amends to such people wherever possible, except when to do so would injure them or others.
Continued to take personal inventory, and when we were wrong, promptly admitted it.
Sought through prayer and meditation to improve our conscious contact with God as we understood Him, praying only for knowledge of His will for us and the power to carry that out.
Having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps, we tried to carry this message to alcoholics, and to practice these principles in all our affairs.
no fucking thanks.
yes fucking thanks for me! I think everyone needs to work on amends and personal inventory. Especially someone who drinks a 12 pack a day and makes snarky comments all day on the Internet.
Erin- maybe you should rename this thread "I'm moving because all my friends are still at the bars" or something like that. And my two cents is to stay by your family. Moving may not solve these social issues
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step one is already bullshit. okay, so i am powerless. i am a victim. a demonic presence inside me is forcing me to drink, and i am powerless to stop on my own. i no longer bear the responsibility for my own actions. now what?
step two, a power greater than myself will restore me? magic sky man is real? horseshit! i do not and will not believe that, so now what?
step three - turn my life and my will over to something which all common sense tells me does not exist? thats impossible.
therefore the idea of turning oneself over to god to remove all shortcomings and and defects of character is likewise impossible.
doing a moral inventory of yourself and striving to rectify any hurt you have done to others should be a daily part of life whether you are an alcoholic or not.
i guess if some people can be cured by belief in an imaginary god and group dynamic, good for them. to me, half the 12 steps are what i would call "god bullshit" and the other half are common sense.
what is amazingly missing from the 12 steps is "stop drinking" but i guess its impossible to exercise free will when you have a "disease" and are by ourselves "powerless over alcohol."
without belief in a higher power to turn your life and your will over to, the rest is worthless. step one declares you powerless over alcohol, so unless you can accept that and have some sort of god to help you, the 12 step program is useless.
you are truly retarded if you don't think alcoholism is a disease. Ask a doctor...or a nurse! Erin?
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i have sought through prayer and meditation to come closer to God as i understand him, and i consciously asked him to guide me on my way, he said "drink up, have a good time". thanks god!
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i have sought through prayer and meditation to come closer to God as i understand him, and i consciously asked him to guide me on my way, he said "drink up, have a good time". thanks god!
i smell liver problems coming...sounds fun. Enjoy the faygo and ancient age. Or natty ice on ice...one of those hasta be tops on your list :-)
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it must be one hell of a disease since people stop drinking on their own all the time, its a disease that can be cured through exercise of free will???
rad!
alcoholism is a choice not a disease, but now that you seem to have all the logical and empirical evidence on your side and claim it is, real fucking nice that you are here calling me "retarded" and making other judgements of something i have no control over. gonna stop at the cancer ward and kick some of those diseased people around next?
i dont need a doctor or a nurse to tell me that a disease cannot be cured by mere exercise of free will. thats common sense. the theory that alcoholism is a disease is absolute bullshit.
"only 25 percent of physicians believed that alcoholism is a disease. The majority believed alcoholism to be a social or psychological problem instead of a disease. (S.I. Mignon. Physicians' Perceptions of Alcoholics: The Disease Concept Reconsidered. Alcoholism Treatment Quarterly, 1996, v. 14, no. 4, pp. 33–45)
A survey of physicians at an annual conference of the International Doctors in Alcoholics Anonymous reported that 80 percent believe that alcoholism is merely bad behavior instead of a disease. (Barrier to Treatment. Alcoholmd - Information About Alcohol and Medicine)
Dr. Thomas R. Hobbs says that "Based on my experiences working in the addiction field for the past 10 years, I believe many, if not most, health care professionals still view alcohol addiction as a willpower or conduct problem and are resistant to look at it as a disease." (T.R. Hobbs. Managing Alcoholism as a Disease. Physician's News Digest, 1998.)"
http://www.baldwinresearch.com/alcoholism.cfm
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i have sought through prayer and meditation to come closer to God as i understand him, and i consciously asked him to guide me on my way, he said "drink up, have a good time". thanks god!
i smell liver problems coming...sounds fun. Enjoy the faygo and ancient age. Or natty ice on ice...one of those hasta be tops on your list :-)
enjoy the view from your high horse as you kick the guy who is down, diseased and powerless... youre a really nice person. i hope you feel great about yourself.
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i have sought through prayer and meditation to come closer to God as i understand him, and i consciously asked him to guide me on my way, he said "drink up, have a good time". thanks god!
i smell liver problems coming...sounds fun. Enjoy the faygo and ancient age. Or natty ice on ice...one of those hasta be tops on your list :-)
enjoy the view from your high horse as you kick the guy who is down, diseased and powerless... youre a really nice person. i hope you feel great about yourself.
i do. Which is it? Are you diseased and powerless? What exactly do you "not have control over"? Your drinking problem?
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Also, I'm pretty sure I could come up with stupid google'd "facts" supporting my side of this argument
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What exactly do you "not have control over"?
i was referencing the 12 step program.
Are you diseased and powerless?
you seem to believe i am. unless there is some new definition of disease that is curable through exercise of free will. at the same time you declare alcoholism a disease, you delight in calling someone stricken with the disease "retarded"... real fucking nice.
well, since only 25% of physicians consider alcoholism a disease, i guess 75% of them are "retarded" too. they should probably check with "Asshole Face" from now on, you seem to have all the answers.
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What exactly do you "not have control over"?
i was referencing the 12 step program.
Are you diseased and powerless?
you seem to believe i am. unless there is some new definition of disease that is curable through exercise of free will. at the same time you declare alcoholism a disease, you delight in calling someone stricken with the disease "retarded"... real fucking nice.
well, since only 25% of physicians consider alcoholism a disease, i guess 75% of them are "retarded" too. they should probably check with "Asshole Face" from now on, you seem to have all the answers.
i have now been declared as all knowing by Officer Brad!! Yay for me! I hope to argue with you again soon. It's been fun douchebag
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you certainly seem to believe you are. douchebag? thats pretty cool too. now, due to a disease i am helpless to cure without turning myself over to god and a room full of dry drunks, i am nothing but a retarded douchebag.
dont flatter yourself, a handful of playground one liner insults hardly is an argument. i could flip you off and fart and it would be a more compelling argument than what you have put forth.
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you certainly seem to believe you are. douchebag? thats pretty cool too. now, due to a disease i am helpless to cure without turning myself over to god and a room full of dry drunks, i am nothing but a retarded douchebag.
dont flatter yourself, a handful of playground one liner insults hardly is an argument. i could flip you off and fart and it would be a more compelling argument than what you have put forth.
how about fat too? You are a fat retarded farting douche lol
Wikipedia seems to have some good info on this DISEASE, quoting sources like the AMA. Not the 3 doctors you quoted. I think the AMA might be reputable...I don't know. Maybe Ziggy is more of an expert
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that was pretty good! i admit i did literally lol.
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that was pretty good! i admit i did literally lol.
good for you lololololololol
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The promulgation of the disease concept, in conjunction with AMA approval, has created a multi-billion dollar treatment industry that contributes billions to the health care industry.
again,
http://www.baldwinresearch.com/alcoholism.cfm
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Since you spent so much time in AA as a kid...was it mommy or daddy that passed this down to you. A 12 pack a day is a problem...ANY doctor would tell you that. I don't need to read your Stephen Baldwin research to know that.
Does that $10/hour pizza job give you benefits? Because you should see a doctor...you are horribly misinformed.
Who am I kidding? Buy tapes from Officer Brad so he can afford to pay for a doctor before he ends up draining our paychecks at a county hospital!!
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i am just following the 12 steps. i realized i am powerless over this disease and i turned it over to the will of a higher power. so far gods will seems to be that i keep doing what i have been doing, so i guess the 12 step program is working.
i dont believe in doctors, they arent mentioned in the 12 step program. i am leaving things up to gods will. so unless i hear otherwise from a higher power, i guess i will be cracking a beer in a couple minutes.
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Wow, okay.
1) Every physician I've ever talked to, and I've talked to plenty, consider alcoholism a disease. It's listed in the DSM-IV a recognized psychiatric disorder. I don't mean any disrespect, I'm about the least controversial person you'll ever meet, I'm just saying.
2) Moving, while it's tempting, scares me. I grew up here, my family is here, etc., and I depend on them for a LOT, the most important of which being childcare. I just had a long conversation on the phone with my dad and he had some pretty good insight on the situation since him and my mom were also young parents. Things would be easier I think if I knew more people with kids. It doesn't help that a lot of the people I used to consider close friends have moved away.
3) Since I do live in a college town there are plenty of things to do, but I have a hard time making new friends and even if I were too, I'd say the chances of meeting someone who has anything in common with me taste-wise are slim to none. I think I am going to take a yoga class, if I can find one.
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As an aside, I just called Goodwill and signed up to do my 30 hours of community service there. I'm doing it in 4 hour chunks. Has anyone on here ever volunteered on Goodwill? I'm not expecting it to be hard labor or anything, but it wasn't my first choice. Basically the only reason I called them is because I can walk there in 15 minutes from my house. I really wanted to do my community service at the animal shelter (I'm sick of humans), but they didn't have any spots available. By the end of the week I'll have 20 out of my 30 hours of community service done, which is encouraging.
I was a hospital volunteer in my teens. I would bring meals to ICU patients and help geezers eat their apple sauce. Erin I don't know how you can stomach that kind of work. You must have constant care-taker burnout. More recently, I spent ten months photographing the insides of kill-shelters in Brooklyn, Trenton and Philly. It was a commissioned coffee table book by some really passionate activist. I cried a lot. It just made me want to get drunk. Most of the volunteers in those places were convicted criminals.
Do you like gardening?
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must be a concept outside of the Midwest. -drunk and confused.
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I like gardening (in theory), but it's the middle of winter in Indiana so that's not really an option. I tried looking for yoga classes and foreign language classes around here, but since I live in a small college town nothing is starting until the beginning of next semester. Which sucks. My mom's answer was "go to church," which I'm pretty sure is not a great way to meet people my age have semi-similar interests as mine.
I know as you get older it gets harder and harder to make new friends, but I don't exactly consider myself old (I'm 24) - but I did get married and have a kid very young, which none of my friends did. It's hard for my husband to relate to what I'm going through because I just don't think he understands why I'm so upset.
As far as nursing - you get used to it. I hate my current job, which is in long-term care with the elderly. I have an interview coming up at a psychiatric hospital, which I'm excited about because I love working in psych.
I talked to my dad earlier and he said basically the same thing happened to him and my mom when they had kids young. Which wasn't exactly encouraging.
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i have friends who seem happy to smoke weed and not drink. maybe you should hang out with hippies?
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Don't have much of an interest in smoking weed anyway, and if I was drug tested at my job not only would I lose my job, I would be reported to the nursing board and possibly lose my license. Nursing boards take a very serious view on illegal substance use - even marijuana.
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I like gardening (in theory), but it's the middle of winter in Indiana so that's not really an option. I tried looking for yoga classes and foreign language classes around here, but since I live in a small college town nothing is starting until the beginning of next semester. Which sucks. My mom's answer was "go to church," which I'm pretty sure is not a hospital, which I'm excited about because I love working in psych.
A yoga studio you can just drop in for a class any day of the week. Google says there is one called community yoga there that has $15/class rate.
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How about magick? You know, just tell your huz that you're doing witchcraft now. That's your new hobby. Free tarot readings. invite some friends and take photos of it for instagram. Have a Tupperware party!
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Actually, don't listen to me. I'm drunk.
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Don't have much of an interest in smoking weed anyway, and if I was drug tested at my job not only would I lose my job, I would be reported to the nursing board and possibly lose my license. Nursing boards take a very serious view on illegal substance use - even marijuana.
you dont have to smoke i was just thinking it might be easier to hang out with stoners than with drunks. probably wouldnt have alot in common though, those peoples whole conversations tend to revolve around boring "Remember when?" drug stories...
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I do think that it sounds like the problem is not so much your location as a shift in your lifestyle. It seems like this is something that happens to most people at some point, it just happened to you earlier than most. You know, if your problem is that you just don't know people who enjoy the same things you do at this point, moving to another city is probably going to make that harder, not easier. Have you thought about book clubs? What about your kid -- do you meet other parents? Surely some of them must be at least slightly interesting?
I don't drink all that much and I never really have (though I do get pretty drunk maybe once a month), but I don't have a problem hanging out with people who do. It seems like it's harder to transition if you used to drink a lot and then stopped, as opposed to never doing it all that much. On the other hand, if I lived in my hometown, a small college town where the social scene revolves around drinking to the exclusion of all else, it would probably be tougher. Buuuut I just looked up Lafayette and it's well over twice the size of my hometown.
I don't know that I completely buy the idea of addiction as a "disease" in the traditional sense, but it obviously goes beyond a "choice." Something doesn't have to be a literal DISEASE for it to be a serious condition. I keep meaning to go to Al-Anon (ok actually other people keep trying to get me to go), but it is honestly so inconvenient to my schedule. Also I feel like the other people there will look down on me for my problems not being serious enough? Actually I should go to a Nar-Anon meeting but there are none in this city, what the fuck Nar-Anon, this is a major city with some major fucking junkies in it, you really think it's more important to have a meeting in fucking Amarillo?
I wrote this while kinda buzzed so feel free to disregard all of it.
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Oh yeah, and: if I were trying to get clean/sober I'm sure I would have a major problem with the god aspect of things, but the people I know who go to meetings are generally clean, and the people I know who refuse to go to meetings are usually more like "clean."
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al anon is kind of horseshit too. my mom went there week after week and everyone told her how bad her life was, and eventually she got a divorce from my dad. years later she openly admits that it was a mistake, and the time she was married was the happiest years of her life. of course thats not the case with everyone, but be careful what "other people" try to talk you into, they arent the ones living your life and as well meaning as they may be, there is no solution that works perfectly for everyone.
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I don't really care to debate the AA program, I don't personally attend meetings, but in response to Erin's trying to find sober people to do stuff with, I still say that the people at meetings are going to generally be sober and they will want to hang out and do sober things, and it also sounds like she may possibly feel some benefit from group therapy, and maybe even having a mentor, but what the fuck do I know? You don't gotta be an alcoholic to go to meetings either. I've never been an alcoholic, but I have attended AA meetings because at one point I was exploring techniques for overcoming other addictive behaviors, and I know people who are addicted to video games, I have known people have been addiction to candy and over the counter medicine that doesn't fuck you up. There are plenty of gamblers at meetings too. Generally, I think most meetings probably try to be inclusive, but like I said, if it's something you're interested in, it's something that takes some work to find the "right" one.
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And the difference between this and church, like your mom recommended, is that there is a good chance that you're going to run into people at meetings with similar interests, at least eventually. I know tons of punks that work the program.
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AA members can do valium, mood elevators, all sorts of addictive drugs as long as they have doc's scrip. Pot w a green card. Nicotine, caffeine. So while everyone at a meeting is almost certainly alcohol free they are not exactly sober.
Al - anon is enablers enabling each other until the co-dependence fest breaks out usually concluding in copious group weeping.
Erin just remember: wherever you go, there you are. Also, the two best places are the one you are getting prepped to go to and the one you just left.
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wherever you go, there you are.
Someone should put this on a bumper sticker.
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alateen was pretty sweet. bunch of teenage girls with low self esteem and father issues in one room. easy pickins for the teenage guys in attendance...
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I first heard it in the movie Buckaroo Banzai.
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Wow, okay.
1) Every physician I've ever talked to, and I've talked to plenty, consider alcoholism a disease. It's listed in the DSM-IV a recognized psychiatric disorder. I don't mean any disrespect, I'm about the least controversial person you'll ever meet, I'm just saying.
I think I am going to take a yoga class, if I can find one.
me too regarding docs. I think anyone worth a piss has to be able to acknowledge the difference between poor choices and addiction. I certainly felt "sick" as a drunk.
Yoga sounds real good!
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And the difference between this and church, like your mom recommended, is that there is a good chance that you're going to run into people at meetings with similar interests, at least eventually. I know tons of punks that work the program.
this is VERY true. Most people just kind of keep it hush hush in public. Like a shitty Fight Club or something
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on the topic of it being a disease...can't remember who said it , but reminds me of some comedian..."the day i'll believe alcohol is a disease, is when i can call my work in the morning, tell em i drank all night, and am still loaded and can't come in - and they'll send me to a hospital, instead of firing my ass!"
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That's how most salaried jobs are, actually.
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even non salaried jobs, i dont know how it is elsewhere but around here if you come to work drunk or miss work because of alcohol or drugs, most places have the option of voluntarily entering treatment. i think it might even be part of wisconsin workmans comp law, i know i have gotten paperwork about it from numerous jobs when hired.
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Thanks to everyone who replied to this, a lot of your responses were really helpful.
Like I said though, I don't think I have a problem with alcohol, or really ever have. I drank I lot when I was 18-19, but after I had my kid, drinking just didn't appeal to me that much. Like I mentioned, when I got pulled over it had been 6 months since I'd even had one beer. In the last year I can count on one hand the number of times I've had a drink. I got really sick last year and was in the hospital for over a week, and now I'm kind of paranoid that drinking would just exacerbate my health issues. I'm not the kind of person that gets "driven to drink," when I get stressed out, depressed, or upset I tend to just kind of hole up in my room and avoid people.
Tina - I looked up the Community Yoga place, and it sounds like a good option. I'm really busy this week, but next week I'll try to check it out.
Jackie - i think you're right about the animal shelters. It probably would depress me. There's a no-kill shelter in town that I might call today (it's 6 AM here, my sleep schedule is fucked up), as well as a wildlife rescue place in the next town over.
As for Al-Anon... I'm not sure if I'm going to go or not. I don't know enough about it. I've stuck with my husband through all of his ups and downs with his alcoholism, and he'd have to do something pretty catastrophic for me to divorce him.
I really hope people come to my Christmas party thing. It should be fun. If there's anyone else on here from Lafayette (attn: Wabash Trash!), please come!
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And regarding the alcohol/work thing - I used to work at a psych/chemical dependency institution and we had tons of people come in who'd gotten caught drinking on the job and were entering treatment. We had one patient who was on a leave of absence from a very well-paying corporate job for heroin addiction.
I'm not gonna spent time debating it, but I do consider addiction in all forms to be a disease - especially since it runs in families. Just like breast cancer, heart disease, etc.
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That's how most salaried jobs are, actually.
I've had mostly salary jobs, and it generally entailed working so many extra hours for free that the previously awesome hourly salary rate started looking pretty shitty in comparison. I know some are able to do th e35 hours (if that) go home at noon on Fridays/call in and "work" from home, but that's certainly not true in the majority of cases, and is less-and-less true since the economy tanked.
I'm really glad I never had a problem with alcohol, especially living in this state and hanging around with the people I hang with. I could drop that shit forever no problem, though I really enjoy good beers and wines in moderation. Good luck to all who need it.
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For me the problem isn't, and never has been, alcohol. It just doesn't interest me anymore.
When I moved to California I lost about 1/2 of my friends, and when I had my kid I lost about 1/3 of my remaining friends. I have casual acquaintances, but no one I know I could count on in an emergency. It doesn't help that a lot of people have moved away.
Maybe it's the season, but I just feel isolated and depressed. I've never been an outgoing person, but my personality hasn't changed since I was 16-17-18-whatever. I've reached out to people but for the most part my calls and texts go unanswered. It also doesn't help that I don't have any other friends with children. I just feel alone, miserable, and bored. Maybe if I lived in a bigger city this wouldn't be an issue. I don't know.
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Tina - I looked up the Community Yoga place, and it sounds like a good option. I'm really busy this week, but next week I'll try to check it out.
Jackie - i think you're right about the animal shelters. It probably would depress me. There's a no-kill shelter in town that I might call today (it's 6 AM here, my sleep schedule is fucked up), as well as a wildlife rescue place in the next town over.
As for Al-Anon... I'm not sure if I'm going to go or not. I don't know enough about it. I've stuck with my husband through all of his ups and downs with his alcoholism, and he'd have to do something pretty catastrophic for me to divorce him.
I really hope people come to my Christmas party thing. It should be fun. If there's anyone else on here from Lafayette (attn: Wabash Trash!), please come!
here's a book preview: http://www.blurb.com/books/2487725
PUPPIES!
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Erin, check yo PMs! I sent you one.
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I have never had a salaried job that would send me on dry duty. Quite the opposite. Did have a cool coworker who covered for me the myriad times whiskey and I overslept. He eventually got canned with me and another coworker for unrelated reasons. That was a bang-up day!
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I think it's law in most places that if you have a drug or alcohol problem that they must offer you rehab. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I'd put money on most salaried jobs having that resource available, whether y'all are aware of it or not.
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I kinda doubt it. I feel like any employer can find a loophole in such a clause, if it exists.
I've heard that restaurants supposedly cannot terminate a chef for drinking too much, since boozing's somewhat encouraged on the job, but I know this to be untrue from experience. You can get fired for anything, really -- just not on paper.
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I dunno, all I know is that I know a bunch of people who instead of getting fired from their jobs, got treatment instead for drug and alcohol problems, when they got bad enough, and a former bandmate of mine even got a bunch of money from grievances when his employer when he was fired for failing a drug test since they didn't offer him treatment, then they later had to hire him back, then he tried assaulting his boss with a hammer and they had to pay for him to get psychiatric help or some shit.
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No, I'm definitely right. I'm looking this shit up and it looks like most states have laws that protect employees from being fired for drug and alcohol addiction, and it appears it's even difficult to fire people for failing drug tests.
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yeah i have had the same experience with many non salaried jobs as well.
alcoholism is considered a disability, its protected by the americans with disabilities act.
if they fire you for being an alcoholic you are eligible for unemployment comp and can file a complaint and even a lawsuit against them if you choose.
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Maybe, but that takes time and effort. It's a lost cause. 'Specially because there's guilt associated with alcoholism -- with me, at least -- so it's easier to just move on.
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I guess that's how many people probably deal with shit, but especially if you're working at a job that is not a small mom and pop place I think you owe it to society in general and humanity at large to take what's rightfully yours. Whether you believe addiction is a disease or not, and I think if you're gonna say it's not, you have no reason to consider most psychiatric disorders diseases, and I don't personally... but it doesn't take a doctor to understand that addicts are disabled. All you have to do is know one to understand that.
Like I've mentioned though, it's not a lost cause for many people, and I know people who have gotten help that way that they desperately needed, and I know people who were generally exploited by their jobs and probably driven to drugs and alcohol by their jobs (among other things) who took full advantage of shit just because, hell, fuck the job, that's how they felt about them as employees.
I think it's important for people to know though that they can't just be pushed around by their employers... unless of course they're like me and they work only in cash, then you just gotta learn how to do some pushing yourself and make sure not to take shit from anyone, and arm yourself.
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i worked for cash for years, then i injured my back. shortly after, i injured my back again. no workmans comp, no health insurance, and no unemployment, obviously. nothing like laying in bed in immense pain, having spent all the cash i had to get a painkiller prescription and wondering how i was going to afford groceries, let alone pay the rent or utilities. we spent that whole winter without heat, not a great time.
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oh well, if nothing else it was during a creative dry spell, and i was inspired to write this anthem:
vicodin, valium, and beer
http://kiwi6.com/file/08laa33900
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I was raised to believe that alcoholism is a disease, since both sides of the family suffered from it terribly, but I was also raised to believe that those afflicted were somehow responsible for their problem. Catholic.
I don't really think it's a disease. I think it's a predisposition, on some level, and though I'm far from the "get over it" attitudinal levee, I do think it's up to an individual to assert themselves to deal with it at the highest possible level they can. That means different things for different people.
I don't blame employers for firing people for being too drunk to perform their duties. I'd do the same, but on a much more human level. I'd at least talk to the person in question first.
As a side: I get pretty fucking aggravated when I hear rallying cries about "supporting small / local businesses," because my experiences working for and dealing with small business owners indicate that they're just as shitty as corporate lords. They just haven't made it to the conglomo level yet.
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Yeah, same goes for indie bands.
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Basically. I would love to introduce some yup 'tard clamoring for local biz support to the owner of Junk.
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That's how most salaried jobs are, actually.
I've had mostly salary jobs, and it generally entailed working so many extra hours for free that the previously awesome hourly salary rate started looking pretty shitty in comparison.
Was gonna say the same - I have a salaried job, and end up working 60-80 hours a week every week.
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I wasn't trying to suggest otherwise. If you wind up strung out they'll probably provide you with resources to get help.
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Ha! A few years back at the same job, a 40ish chick came to work drunk and was talking all kinds of crazy shit to everybody...they offered her alcoholic counseling/rehabilitation but she chose to resign instead. She was like, 'Fuck that, I'd rather be unemployed than sober!" Knew a guy whose uncle turned down a similar offer in regards to his sexual preference for teenage boys. "No thanks!"
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i worked for cash for years, then i injured my back. shortly after, i injured my back again. no workmans comp, no health insurance, and no unemployment, obviously. nothing like laying in bed in immense pain, having spent all the cash i had to get a painkiller prescription and wondering how i was going to afford groceries, let alone pay the rent or utilities. we spent that whole winter without heat, not a great time.
I have degenerative disc disease. I never injured my back doing anything, so it was kind of made as a diagnosis of exclusion. It's not normal for a 24-year-old to have a spine with MRI-confirmed degenerative patterns of someone in their 50s/60s.
I'm currently uninsured. I just (literally, last night) started a new job and I won't get healthcare until February. My pain every day goes anywhere from a 3 to a 10. I take two painkillers every day, a long-acting one and a short-acting drug for breakthrough. One is unbelievably cheap (which is why they also give it to chronic pain Medicaid people); the short-acting drug is incredibly expensive. Like, hundreds of dollars expensive. I'm not going to mention what particular medicine I take because of the stigma associated, but I bet a few smart people on here can guess what they are.
Pain sucks. Not having money sucks. I try to consider myself lucky that I have a degree and a job that pays (marginally) more than $20/hr. But there are definitely days when I feel more disabled than the elderly people I take care of for a living.
New topic - My husband is a chef, and working in the restaurant industry has done nothing but cause him continued problems with alcohol. I think it's just the industry. If he worked in, say, an office - he would never have had half the problems he's had.
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No, I'm definitely right. I'm looking this shit up and it looks like most states have laws that protect employees from being fired for drug and alcohol addiction, and it appears it's even difficult to fire people for failing drug tests.
You're right about this, once employed a company is supposed to offer treatment if there's an addiction issue. The problem is there are also anti-drug/alcohol company statements you must also sign, and in some states (all 50 states are very different in how they handle employee rights) this can supercede the state law, if they have one.
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I had to fire a dude I really liked 5-6 years ago because he was caught drinking in his car at lunch time. He was, while young (he was in his late 50s at the time), a Vice President for a company that would at least ring a bell for everyone here. High achiever, incredibly smart and charming when he wanted to be, but also the most cynical person I've ever met, which is probably one reason why we got along. He basically thought every single human was an idiot. He also listened to punk in the 70s and would quote Pistols songs regularly. He knew all the top business folks in the GB area, including ex-Packer Hall of Famers, and seemed to be from a premier local family. I'd wondered why his life had gone to shit personally and professionally (divorce, estranged from all but his mother, OK mid-level jobs but nothing high profile), he hid his drinking pretty well I guess, but it made sense looking back obviously. He went down fighting, but he went down. He was embarassed as hell and I felt bad for him. I told him I wasn't mad and hoped that he'd be OK, but he denied drinking to the end, even though he was seen right outside the HR office by the head HR lady and we saw Hamms (fucking Hamms!) on his front seat of his car. Hamms. Haven't talked to him since, though he left a couple voicemails telling me he could find me an ace job here or there a few years back. Hope he's OK, but I doubt it.
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For the record, I believe everyone I know who went to rehab through work like I describe, we'll the jobs tried to fight it and block it every single time. These all required time on the phone, arguing with HR and talking to agents from Unemployment and doctors.
No company that isnt a tiny mom and pop is going to risk a lawsuit over this shit because they will lose and it's an expensive battle to lose.
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Also, any doctors willing to prescribe a 24 year old hardcore opiates along with benzos for anxiety is signing the patients death warrant. That is not medicine. That is drug dealing.
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Also, any doctors willing to prescribe a 24 year old hardcore opiates along with benzos for anxiety is signing the patients death warrant. That is not medicine. That is drug dealing.
this is thee most intelligent statement i've ever read here.
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My last MRI showed that I have essentially zero supportive tissue between my L4 and L5 vertebrae. The discs are herniated, and the vertebrae press on my spinal nerves, which sends spasms of pain down both hips and sometimes to my knees. This all happened after I had meningitis last year - which doesn't just affect your brain, it affects your spinal column, too.
I've been on the exact same medication for a year. I don't think I could get "high" off of it if I even tried. I allows me to function and do my job. Maybe I could be on disability if I wanted to be, but I don't.
I'm not trying to be rude, but it's pretty hurtful to be constantly stigmatized for something that isn't your fault. I didn't chose to get viral meningitis and spend a week in the hospital, and I didn't chose to develop disc issues. Coincidentally, I just got back from getting my pain medicine filled at the pharmacy, and I always get attitude there, too. I don't abuse my pain medication. I don't sell it. I see a specialist who drug tests me every month to make sure I'm taking what I'm supposed to be taking and nothing else.
Chronic pain doesn't just affect the elderly. I've met other people at my doctor's office who have conditions like rheumatoid arthritis, lupus, etc. that are my age or slightly older. I don't go see just some quack, I was referred by my hospital neurologist to a pain management specialist - who used to work in anesthesia with my grandpa, before my grandpa died (of liver failure!). Just to bring things full circle. I tried non-pharmacological means of pain relief, such as epidural steroid injections, but without insurance I can't afford the $$$ that costs.
Even WITH medication I still have 1 or 2 "bad days" in any given week where I just feel like curling up in bed with a heating pad. Again, I'm not trying to be rude (wow this topic has gone off-track), but it's very hurtful to be called a drug addict when you depend on pain relief to function. I'm a nurse, and no one, unless I told them, would know that I am on pain medicine. I get a lot of reward out of working with the very sick and/or elderly, which is what I currently do - it reminds me that life could always be worse. I'm lucky for what I have, which is an understanding doctor, good parents, and a beautiful son.
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I never said you were getting high, I said it will kill you.
I know plenty about pain, but I come from a family which is deeply stricken by auto-immune disorders, so I know a bit about how medication can give you a better quality of life, but significantly decrease the length of one's life as well.
It's the doctors obligation to offer you alternatives to opiates, and like I said, if you're on benzos as well, either you're doctor shopping or the reason why the pharmacists are giving you looks is because the people prescribing these drugs to you are breaking the law.
Try a chiropractor, or acupuncture, or running, physical therapy, hypnosis, weed. Shit like methadone is a last resort. I know a little bit about that drug. I know they give it in pain clinics for what you're describing, and I also know that it's something that is the absolute final prescription, because you never get off it, except through a body bag. It's not a drug that is intended to ever be gotten off of. So, frankly speaking, whether you are trying to get off or not, your doctor has turned you into a junkie, so, yeah, there is social stigma attached to that.
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K - thousands of doctors are willing to scrip powerful psychotropics to 4 year olds so while your post is right on, the age bar for those who are dealt dangerous drugs by physicians is way lower.
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Also, that's fucked up you work with the sick when you could nod out at any second. You could kill someone.
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I have never nodded out from my pain medication. I've never made a drug error, or a charting error even. I don't take any short-acting pain medicine while I'm at work. I got my license in June, and I have yet to be reprimanded for anything close to nodding out. I have met several other nurses who are in the same situation I'm in, either because of a condition similar to mine, or because they injured themselves on the job.
I don't know what I did wrong, or if you're just trying to antagonize me or what. I got meningitis at the end of my 3rd semester of nursing school, and at that point, I didn't exactly feel like throwing in the towel and giving up on what I'd been working towards for two years already. Like I said before, I've been on the same medication, the same dose, for a year. I'm closely monitored by a board-certified specialist. I guess I have two options - stop taking my meds, be in constant pain and become a burden on my family, or take medication and work and contribute something to society. One Percocet (which i don't even take when I'm at work) is not going to make me nod out after taking the same dose for a little shy of a year. Again, I'm not sure if you're just trying to make me feel bad, but your comments are extremely hurtful. Trust me, if I could wake up tomorrow and not have DDD, of course I would. I didn't go to my doctor with my palm out asking for a narc script. I have never, and will never, go to work if I feel like I'm at all unsafe to practice. Trust me, I didn't seek any of this out. Who would? I didn't bullshit anyone, in the past year I've had three MRIs, a lumbar puncture, a blood patch, and three epidural steroid injections. Pain medicine was my last choice.
I don't mean to be so defensive, but this is a really sensitive subject for me. The right pain medication, at the right dose, with careful monitoring has allowed me to be a better wife, mother, and employee than I ever could be if I was in constant pain. I know there will probably come a time in the next 10-20 years when I might not be able to work anymore, and that scares the shit out of me. I truly don't know what else to say. It's very hurtful to have to defend yourself against something you never chose in the first place. I wish I'd never even brought it up.
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Not trying to be a dick, I'm just trying to be honest because you're a friend. You're on here crying out for help, so that's what I'm doing. You keep mentioning your pain meds, but you're on benzos too for social anxiety, and the two together are a killer. I understand that you're prescribed to these drugs, so you feel like what I'm saying is somehow unfair, but it's not, it's just all the truth. Prescription drug addiction is an epidemic in this country, and I'm not talking about hicks in the sticks shooting oxy. You're obviously a victim of lazy doctoring.
My cousin Joey was diagnosed with Junior Rheumetoid Arthritis when he was like six years old. Trust me, neither of us know pain like he does. Last spring, he had a major flare up which prevented him from starting classes he had signed up for, and his way of dealing with all the pain and shit was getting on a bike and riding it from San Diego to Portland, Maine while soliciting donations for Arthritis research. He wasn't expected to live to 21 because of all the drugs they have him on to counter act the effects of his disease. He had no marrow in his leg when his Arthritis was discovered. He is in constant pain, but he finds effective pain management through activity. I understand that's probably not going to be what works for you, but your doctors not forcing you to seek other options is criminal negligence at best.
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Erin S, I may be remembering incorrectly and it's obviously none of my concern but since you brought up it up didn't you post here a while ago that you'd been reprimanded at work for looking or being zonked out at work, something to do with pills? If not, please accept my sincere apologies. Don't get me wrong -- do what you will, but it does seem like that's been an issue before, and I've known quite a few people who are dependent on prescription opiates, and virtually all of them had a legitimate physical ailment at one time or another that was the original reason for taking 'em but soon became a pretext for it. Not saying that's you, but that's what it sounds like.
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Also, any doctors willing to prescribe a 24 year old hardcore opiates along with benzos for anxiety is signing the patients death warrant. That is not medicine. That is drug dealing.
this is thee most intelligent statement i've ever read here.
by no means am i passing judgement on any one here. the facts are that the united states consumes 80% of the worlds painkillers and recently the number one cause of accidental deaths amoung young people has become accidental overdose of prescription medications. it outkills car accidents.
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Hey as long as we are talking about prescription drugs and whatnot, anybody know if it's cool to take Tramadol with Suboxone?
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If you're on subs I'd recommend staying away from drugs completely, but I don't think Tramadol will interact with the Narcan in subs, but it will probably show up on a drug test.
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What's the point of taking suboxone if you're actively attempting to circumvent it though?
(edit: fuckin' autocorrect)
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I dont think Tramadol will show up on a drug test, as its not technically an opiate - i got prescribed that stuff once and have no clue why you'd want to take it - i got it pushed on me by a dentist, who basically accused me of trying to scam drugs (though i was in such bad pain i couldn't sleep), and refused to refill my vicodin script...it didn't seem to have any pain-relief (at least not more than OTC stuff) properties, or recreational value whatsoever. No way its gonna have any recreational value if you're on subs.
and kevin is right about the prescription meds...benzos and opiates combined sounds pretty dangerous. I've been taking benzos for anxiety purposes, never once got "high" on them, and it's still a fucking bitch to get off them.
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What's the point of taking subprime if you're actively attempting to circumvent it though?
Yeah, I mean, I dunno. I'm not asking for myself, I just want to make sure somebody else is being safe. Personally, Tramadol does almost nothing for pain for me either, it just makes me super-sleepy and queasy. Thanks for the info though!
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Erin S., i dont know you but id say people are trying to give you advice, not make you feel bad. you are kind of the queen of missing the point, it seems.
i also remember the anecdote about being reprimanded for being zonked at work. maybe you were never "written up," but ya cant really get so defensive about the "nodding out" worry when you were like, uh, kinda nodding out?
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Erin S, I may be remembering incorrectly and it's obviously none of my concern but since you brought up it up didn't you post here a while ago that you'd been reprimanded at work for looking or being zonked out at work, something to do with pills? If not, please accept my sincere apologies. Don't get me wrong -- do what you will, but it does seem like that's been an issue before, and I've known quite a few people who are dependent on prescription opiates, 3nd virtually all of them had a legitimate physical ailment at one time or another that was the original reason for taking 'em but soon became a pretext for it. Not saying that's you, but that's what it sounds like.
I was reprimanded when I was still in school for being to "zonked" in class. That was when i was taking Xanax, but not pain medicine. I don't know if I was super sensitive to it or what, but it made me basically a zombie. I was also seeing a doctor at the time who spent all of about 10 minutes per session with me and didn't address most of my concerns. I haven't taken Xanax for a long time, and am on a completely different medicine now. I also switched psychiatrists, and now I see one who spends an hour per session with addressing my anxiety. The goal is to eventually get off the low dose of anxiety medicine I'm on. I know better than to take the two together and honestly, working 4rd shift I mostly just take it to sleep when I get off work.
I don't doctor shop. I see two doctors - a psychiatrist, and a pain specialist. Indiana makes it pretty much impossible to doctor shop with something called INSPECT reports. Every time I get a controlled substance filled, it gets logged into a system. Since I'm a pain management patient, I have one run on me every month to prove that I'm NOT doctor shopping.
And my doctor did try many other approaches before pharmacological methods. Like I said, I have had numerous steroid injections, a blood patch, I've been through physical therapy and even tried using a TENS unit. Nothing helped. The last time I saw my doctor he told me that the only other solution would be surgery - a double laminectomy to remove the herniated portions of my discs from pressing on the nerves. If I had health insurance, I would schedule the surgery as soon as possible. I don't want to be on pain medicine. Unfortunately, I'm kind of in a bind right now - I need the medicine to function so that I can work, and by Feb. I will be eligible for health care. As soon as I can have the surgery, I'm going to have it.
Besides the drug testing that I mentioned, I also have random pill counts to make sure I'm not abusing my medicine. As soon as I get the surgery and am able to get off meds, I will. Until then I am just trying to live my life like everyone else, be a good wife and mother, a good caregiver, and a good friend. I'd like to say I do the best I can, under the circumstances.
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And, of course I am grateful for the advice everyone has given me. I wish I could say more, but I have to start getting ready for work.
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Would this thread be considered social interaction without alcohol.
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Would this thread be considered social interaction without alcohol.
yes...as long as you're not drinking while you read it.
Anxiety meds and pain pills sounds a little scary to me too. I take a little klonopin now and again (ok...like every day) and made the mistake of taking two Tylenol once too. I passed out while standing up, hit my head, couldn't get out of my stupor for a good ten minutes. Made it to bed. Had a hell of a time waking up in the morning and I had drooled like a motherfucker.
Good times
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I know some people who have died mixing benzos and opiates, but I've experimented with the combination myself once or twice. Last time I mixed em I later heard from my wife about how a show promoter saw me teetering in a corner and rushed over just in time to catch me as I passed out standing up in the front row of a show. He felt it neccesary to let someone know, because it appeared serious... Mixing opiates and benzos always is. Could be safer to speedball.
I say good luck to the original poster and her doctors. Perhaps they know something I don't.
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I'm drunk. Hey!
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same here, word. last night was the worst, ran out of beer so started drinking homemade wine and shots, holy hell did i ever feel beat to fuck today. woke up at 2pm still noticeably drunk.
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Message board sarcasm aside, sounds like you have a tough life Erin. Hope it gets better. Best of luck to you.
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Message board sarcasm aside, sounds like you have a tough life Erin. Hope it gets better. Best of luck to you.
indeed. if youre still wondering i dont think moving to a bigger city is the answer to your problems.
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Hey as long as we are talking about prescription drugs and whatnot, anybody know if it's cool to take Tramadol with Suboxone?
That absolutely depends on the dosage of both drugs. Talk to a (good) doctor.
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Message board sarcasm aside, sounds like you have a tough life Erin. Hope it gets better. Best of luck to you.
Thank you.
I just hope that when I get health insurance through my employer my surgery is covered, so I can get the problem fixed and not think about it anymore. I wasn't really looking out to share a ton in information about my personal life - I was just responding to Officer Brad X's post about back injuries.
On a completely different topic - we put up our Christmas tree today, so I'm totally ready to have this Christmas party. I'm still a little worried that not a lot of people will come, but at the very least it will be an opportunity for me to play records around some sort of an audience for the first time in about 5 years. Unfortunately, our cats just think the tree is a giant jungle gym and our three year old keeps re-arranging the decorations on it.
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And to whoever asked about Tramadol: I can't believe they prescribe that, because it has turned out to cause so many problems with so many patients. No, it is not technically an opiate so it shouldn't affect your Suboxone, but check with a doctor or pharmacist about that.
What it does so is dramatically lower the seizure threshold in many people. When I still worked at a chemical dependency/psych unit I heard at least 2-3 times from people that they'd had seizures while purposely trying to get high on Tramadol. So if you have any kind of seizure history, I would stay far, far away. The last place I worked, we kept it in the narc drawer, and where I work now we don't even bother. So it doesn't seem like anyone can really figure out what exactly to do with Tramadol.
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Even if you take an opiate while on Subs, it won't exactly "affect" anything. You'd just be wasting drugs/wouldn't feel it.
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That's not true, you can absolutely overdose on opiates while on subs. There is not enough Naloxone to eliminate high leves of opiates (but you won't feel as high as you should since your receptors are being blocked by the subs), which is why people circumvent subs by shooting twice as much dope. Trust me, it works, not well, but well enough that junkies do it on a daily basis. What can happen is that when the subs wear off, you're receptors are flooded with dope and your body can start experiencing the depressant effects on your nervous system and you can nod out and never wake up. It happens.
The fact of the matter is, if you're on suboxone, either work the shit or just fucking go back to using. What's the point in trying to kick opiates if you're still using opiates? Obviously this is every kicking junkie's daily predicament, but seriously, if you got someone close to you trying to pop pills while taking subs, don't be afraid to tell them to their face that they're a fucking idiot, or you may soon be relying on your memory to see that same face.
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Also, this is neither here nor there, but I am especially turned off by prescription junkies. How fucking pathetic! You don't even have the romance of dope. It's fucking bourgeois hick/suburban addiction for squares. I'm not saying that people should use dope. Not at all. I do have infinite more respect for those that do, when compared to those that are addicted to pills though. Fucking pathetic.
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Oh, I didn't mean you can't O.D.!
Yeah, going back n' forth w/ subs and dope is a HORRIBLE idea. It just builds up your tolerance. You're right, either stick w/ your treatment or be a junkie.
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Also, this is neither here nor there, but I am especially turned off by prescription junkies. How fucking pathetic! You don't even have the romance of dope. It's fucking bourgeois hick/suburban addiction for squares. I'm not saying that people should use dope. Not at all. I do have infinite more respect for those that do, when compared to those that are addicted to pills though. Fucking pathetic.
I know what you're saying, but i gotta disagree. The worst feeling in the world is being sick, copping, then realizing you got bad shit. Pills you know it's gonna be good.
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Well, I disagree with that too. With pills I always knew it was gonna be bad. Synthetic dope is the worst shit in the world. It's not about that though, it's about the fact that prescription junkies are like I said, squares. AT LEAST with real junkies you know that these are people that generally made a conscious break with society. They entered into a pact with a substance that they knew would leave them outside of society and the law. Actual junkies are a culture and society unto itself. There is something to it. It's black, deadly, rotten and pathetic, but it's something. Prescription drug addiction is for your fucking high school principle or you bible thumping mother. Gross.
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Also, it should be noted that taking any CNS depressant while on any type of opiate maintenance drug (Suboxone, Methadone) will actually INCREASE your chance of overdose.
Don't fuck around with booze, or pills, or dope or benzos when you're getting clean. I've known more people to die while "clean" or trying to get clean than while actively pursuing their addiction.
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I have a hard time with the notion that only cool people shoot heroin. You can come back and say that's not what you're saying, but based on the posts above...that's what you're saying.
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Well, I disagree with that too. With pills I always knew it was gonna be bad. Synthetic dope is the worst shit in the world. It's not about that though, it's about the fact that prescription junkies are like I said, squares. AT LEAST with real junkies you know that these are people that generally made a conscious break with society. They entered into a pact with a substance that they knew would leave them outside of society and the law. Actual junkies are a culture and society unto itself. There is something to it. It's black, deadly, rotten and pathetic, but it's something. Prescription drug addiction is for your fucking high school principle or you bible thumping mother. Gross.
Needles are gross!
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There is nothing cool about shooting heroin, and obviously people who use heroin are not inherantly cool. They are inherantly cooler than people who pop pills, in my opinion. Aesthetic preference.
...and make no mistake about it, if you use either, you're just making yourself The Man's bitch either way. Pill poppers to me are extra pathetic in that they live under the delusion that they are somehow morally superior to your typical street junkie. AT LEAST yer street junkies are out there risking their freedom for their fix. They are outlaws, pathetic, broken people, but they are actively, and knowingly breaking the law. At any moment a heroin user risks felony charges. They could go to PRISON at any second simply for who they are. Most pill poppers graduate to heroin eventually anyway. You have to with the price of pills when yer habit gets too big. There's nothing special about either. It's not even cliche, it's a trap that was designed to entrap you, so there is no rebellion there in the end, you're just following protocal. Still, at that stage where people are still using pills, the delusion is particularly absurd.
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Needles are gross!
If you wanna avoid "gross" you best avoid opiates.
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Both are the polar opposite of "cool". More like just plain depressing as HELL.
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Needles are gross!
If you wanna avoid "gross" you best avoid opiates.
Good point!
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Yeah, there is nothing "cool" about dope sickness. It's about as far from being detached as one can be.
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I haven't read this thread at all yet, and maybe eventually get around to it, but I'll go ahead and say that I had to quit drinking due to my health recently, and I'm only 24. I really fucked my stomach up bad, got the doctor's orders, and I still haven't recovered (even having been sober for a few weeks now).
I was the guy that started the "on the wagon" thread a while back, by the way.
I've had a pretty hard time with the social aspect of things, as well. People still call and ask if I want to meet them at the bar, but somehow drinking water at the bar just quite as much of a good time. I've been doing my best to be productive, and I've been writing music/reading/watching movies as much as I can stand, but the days definitely feel a lot longer lately (days I don't have to work, at least). On the flipside, I wasted a lot of time in the last six or seven years being shitfaced. I do wish I had practiced moderation a bit better, though, as there are definitely days that I want to just drink a few beers and I can't even do that.
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If you don't smoke weed, I'd still recommend hanging out with stoners. They often prefer to hang out at home to the bar, and they usually have something distracting happening (video games, movies, music - often all three at once) which should help with awkwardness of sober hangs.
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If you don't smoke weed, I'd still recommend hanging out with stoners. They often prefer to hang out at home to the bar, and they usually have something distracting happening (video games, movies, music - often all three at once) which should help with awkwardness of sober hangs.
k. is a smart man...tons of great posts on this thread. This is certainly one of them. You're right about opiates and subs...both are pretty pathetic. I also see your point on the subject of pills vs. dope to be pretty right on. It's a dark circle...but at least real junkies have a circle
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I haven't read this thread at all yet, and maybe eventually get around to it, but I'll go ahead and say that I had to quit drinking due to my health recently, and I'm only 24. I really fucked my stomach up bad, got the doctor's orders, and I still haven't recovered (even having been sober for a few weeks now).
I was the guy that started the "on the wagon" thread a while back, by the way.
Glad to hear you are working on being sober! It'll take a little longer than a few weeks to feel better...but it's coming I promise
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When's the X-MAS PARTY?! Save me pills, loaded punch and good food. Hoping to be back in town in a week or less.
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I just feel alone, miserable, and bored. Maybe if I lived in a bigger city this wouldn't be an issue. I don't know.
Moving to a big city won't change any of this. In fact each time I have moved to new cities, I found it to be extremely isolating for the first year or two. I'm EXTREMELY outgoing and pretty good at meeting people, but it takes a while to find and make actual FRIENDS. Especially as you get older or have other tie downs (husband, kid).
Indianapolis is a pretty big boozing/weed smokin' town... and the music scene is bar-centric (or at least that's my experience). Maybe you need some cheap hobbies? It's a college town.. they've got to have something.
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If you don't smoke weed, I'd still recommend hanging out with stoners. They often prefer to hang out at home to the bar, and they usually have something distracting happening (video games, movies, music - often all three at once) which should help with awkwardness of sober hangs.
k. is a smart man...tons of great posts on this thread. This is certainly one of them. You're right about opiates and subs...both are pretty pathetic. I also see your point on the subject of pills vs. dope to be pretty right on. It's a dark circle...but at least real junkies have a circle
Yes, much better idea to not only worry about OD'ing, dopesickness, losing friends/family, etc... but with shooting dope you can also worry about getting Hepatitis!
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Have not drank in 2 months.
It sucks.
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Yep, losing loved ones to hepatitis sucks.
People also get it from pills, and from coke, and tattoos. Don't share dollar bills.
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Yep, losing loved ones to hepatitis sucks.
People also get it from pills, and from coke, and tattoos. Don't share dollar bills.
My father contracted it from dirty needles in prison in the mid-80s and last year had to undergo a life-saving liver transplant because the treatments destroyed his first liver slowly and painfully over time. I also lost a friend 2 weeks ago who contracted HIV intravenously. I mean... Of all the ways to get high, that's gotta be the dumbest.
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Well, knowing a thing or two about that lifestyle - I can't speak for all, but what I've seen is that mainly it's something people turn to when they've accepted "fate." It's a protracted suicide. I've never met a junkie who wasn't suicidal or at one time dated and lived with a suicidal junkie whose addiction was communicable.
I'm sorry about that. I've had three cousins go through Interferon, and with one of them the treatment didn't take. After a long, protracted fight against liver failure, he ended up taking his own life.
My cousin Paul was very important to me. It's hard for me to explain my relationship with him. He was one of my dad's best friends growing up, but they were cousins, and my dad's immediate family I guess always told him to stay away from that side of the family, but my dad was the black sheep, so of course that's where he went. When I was a kid, my dad wasn't around a lot, so I guess I sought male presence in my life. Well, when I was about eight years old, bumming around town, as I was want to do as a kid with no supervision I ran into some kid of the street. I don't even remember his name. He's not so important to the story as who his mom's boyfriend was, who was my cousin. It was weird, I went to his place and we hung out and then his "step dad" told me he was my kin.
From there a relationship bloomed that was actually outside of "family" though he was family. He always had my back. He always tried to impart wisdom to me, to maybe help me miss some of the shit he hit falling down the hole of life. I'm now closer to that side of the family than I am my own father's.
Anyway, I personally tend not to think of needle users as choosing the "dumbest" way to get high. I mean, most junkies have a contract with the reaper, it'd only be dumb if they weren't trying to actively trying to die.
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Anyway, if you wanna bag on junkies putting needles into their arm, I sure hope to fuck you never share bills or straws with people when you're doing coke. I guess people are just ignorant, but to me it's worse than "dumb" and nobody bats and eye about doing that shit all that time that would look down upon a needle user who has never used a dirty!
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Drew, please come if you can - my party's tonight at 8-ish-o'clock.
I am in the process of making a kick-ass boozy punch - you hopefully won't see us imbibing but I encourage my guests to to their little hearts' content.
In the punch:
2 cups pineapple juice
1 cup triple sec
1 cup brandy
1/2 cup Cointreau
1 can apricot nectar
1 quart ginger ale
2 bottles of champagne
raspberries as a garnish
Yum, right? My husband is also making puff pastries with chocolate chips. Bustin' out some good records. Hopefully enough people will show up that we're not just left alone with a bunch of leftover shit.
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Using dirty needles = bad. Everyone knows that.
In Kevin's defense there are about a million ways to get yourself infected with godawful bullshit - this little old lady I work with happened to contract MRSA on her skin from somewhere (probably the hospital) and know she has a gaping pressure ulcer on her coccyx. When I pack it, I can stick my first into it. Not to be graphic, but yeah. Just last night I was trying to start an IV on a dehydrated elderly woman with shit veins, and as soon as I stuck the needle in, I felt the vein blow. This happened twice before I gave up and got a more experienced nurse to try. After two tries, he FINALLY got it. Worked with tons of MRSA/VRE/C-diff patients, and I've never gotten any of those diseases... Use common sense, wash yer hands once in a while and follow standard precautions. Assume everyone is infected with something. They probably are.
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Assume everyone is infected with something. They probably are.
Real talk
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Using dirty needles = bad. Everyone knows that.
In Kevin's defense there are about a million ways to get yourself infected with godawful bullshit - this little old lady I work with happened to contract MRSA on her skin from somewhere (probably the hospital) and know she has a gaping pressure ulcer on her coccyx. When I pack it, I can stick my first into it. Not to be graphic, but yeah. Just last night I was trying to start an IV on a dehydrated elderly woman with shit veins, and as soon as I stuck the needle in, I felt the vein blow. This happened twice before I gave up and got a more experienced nurse to try. After two tries, he FINALLY got it. Worked with tons of MRSA/VRE/C-diff patients, and I've never gotten any of those diseases... Use common sense, wash yer hands once in a while and follow standard precautions. Assume everyone is infected with something. They probably are.
Us hospital workers cannot be killed by mere disease at this point...our immune systems are unbreakable
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Using dirty needles = bad. Everyone knows that.
In Kevin's defense there are about a million ways to get yourself infected with godawful bullshit - this little old lady I work with happened to contract MRSA on her skin from somewhere (probably the hospital) and know she has a gaping pressure ulcer on her coccyx. When I pack it, I can stick my first into it. Not to be graphic, but yeah. Just last night I was trying to start an IV on a dehydrated elderly woman with shit veins, and as soon as I stuck the needle in, I felt the vein blow. This happened twice before I gave up and got a more experienced nurse to try. After two tries, he FINALLY got it. Worked with tons of MRSA/VRE/C-diff patients, and I've never gotten any of those diseases... Use common sense, wash yer hands once in a while and follow standard precautions. Assume everyone is infected with something. They probably are.
Us hospital workers cannot be killed by mere disease at this point...our immune systems are unbreakable
I still have a shit immune system. I'm on a Z-Pack for a upper respiratory condition right now. I am, according to my husband who obviously loves me so much, "constantly sick and if I had been born in the 1800s I would have died a long time ago." I was tested for every immune deficiency problem under the sun when I had viral meningitis, because it was weird in and of itself that a "healthy" 23-year-old would get viral meningitis in the first place. Nothing turned up except a very high EBV (Epstein-Barr virus) titer.
My party went okay. Nothing great. Had to spend the next day with my husband's family, who don't like me because I don't share their down-home country attitude and they think I'm cold, or a bitch, or something. I have to work the next three nights. Merry Christmas to me!
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i had to work tonight too. lets just say that the type of person inconsiderate and thoughtless enough to order delivery on a night like tonight is exactly the type of person who doesnt tip. a whopping $15 in tips over dinner rush, significantly less than my usual average.
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Tango Fistula your username reminds me of an unfortunate incident at work last night... I was trying to put a pressure dressing on the dialysis fistula of a very angry, combative old man w/ dementia, and needless to say... Blood everywhere. At least I was making some of that "awesome" holiday bonus pay.
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Drink alone! Fuck people! I suck at talking with people and hate bars/clubs. It just seems like trendy people trying to congregate, talk, dance, etc. I never fit in there or anywhere else. Always been an outcast and loner. I only looked this shit up 'cause I'm supposed to take this girl out... We are supposed to go to Tea Chai Te? (PDX spot, NW 23rd, Sellwood, Burnside /// Can you impress girls by telling them you have a couple hundred stickers on NW 23rd but that half of them have been BUFFED?? FUCK THIS CITY!!) but then one of my siblings told this girl I'd take her to like 5-6 other places "'cause it's in the same neighborhood" and that "I don't talk". UGH!! Fucking hate this shit. It makes me cringe so fucking much but I shut my mouth and take it 'cause it's my sibling. I'm just fucking shy and it takes me forever to be able to talk to people properly. I don't like going out places that much because it seems like everyone sort of fits in somewhere but I've never felt that way so I'll just sit in the corner alone or with a friend but feel like I'm bringing people down. Fucked up. Drinking again. Fuck!! Mail friends about shit but they don't fucking care. People are such a letdown. Write long shit.. get no reply or 1 sentence reply. Write more and get no reply. Yeah. Hate everyone!
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It's also fucked up when your friends are total alcoholic punks / music nerds and either have a ton of cheap booze on hand (Rainier, Pabst) here. PACIFIC NORTHWEST SHIT BEER. Or Your friends live close to bars or DJ at bars. I like hanging out to some degree but really don't talk to people. Never know what to say. Social anxiety. I don't like going to bars / clubs 'cause of the "fit in" atmosphere / that shit is going to kill me eventually and I know it. Just the way it is.
I've also got relatives that work for alcohol companies / bars and I can get free booze any day of the week so that doesn't help. Blackout drunk punx. Moving to PDX was a bad idea for trying to stay sober. Too fucking hard. Too close to the fucking graves. Too fucking alone. Too much time to think. Too much everything. Too many fake people here. People that care but really don't. People that claim to have your back but really don't. I'm not that way. I tell people I have their backs 100% and mean it. When everyone is dead you only have your friends. Ya know?
I really sort of only understand the street at this point. Names & such. Graffiti and stickers. It gives me a sense of belonging / community even though I don't know any of these people. I think if you've never fit in anywhere and then find something you can connect to / understand that you attach yourself to it and don't let go for anything. I'd stick up for any of the other people into the same thing 'cause we're into the same thing, though anonymously. I don't like social media or self-promotion but some people are into it and I can't blame people for having different ideas / wants than me.
Booze & Vandalism.
What the fuck else is there to do in life?
Fuck music! This is immediate!! >:( Girls and guys and kids, etc. I've been out before at like noon putting shit up and had kids shouting from cars if I want to trade stickers. So fucking cool! 8)
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I agree with you, I definitely need a hobby. The trouble is that we don't have a ton of money right now, and it's the middle of December in Indiana. In the summer I go horseback riding, which is a great stress reliever. Suggestions welcome. I agree that there are no easy answers. I've lost 15 pounds since I stopped drinking, which is pretty rewarding in and of itself - I weigh the same now as I did in 9th grade. I guess I can always start crocheting or cross-stitching just to complete the old-lady image.
We're looking into moving to a bigger city (Indianapolis) in the next 1-2 years, so hopefully there there will be more opportunities for alcohol-free good times. I live in West Lafayette currently. Home of Purdue University and not much else.
Brooklyn's too far away for me, I would get home sick. I totally see the appeal, but I'm too much of a wimp to live 1-2 hours driving distance from my family.
Hey!! I should introduce you to my friend! He's from NY, loves punk, and going Portland Meadows to bet on the horses.
Not drinking is pretty overrated. It's like never cumming. You can't abstain forever! The only upside to not drinking is you might get more exercise or live longer and who cares about either when you're skinny and on a death trip (feel like committing suicide for 3+ days in a row.). So many good bridges and plenty of belts around.
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suitor
Do you ever have to work?
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My area of expertise! I've either been pregnant or breastfeeding for the last year and a half so I've got the non-drinking social life down. Here's how I have fun without bars:
1.) Potlucks - If money is tight offer to host and you usually end up with tons of yummy leftovers. Discussed in greater detail here: http://terminal-boredom.com/forums/index.php?topic=19705.0
2.) Fancy dinner night - invite people over for a fancy dinner. We're friends with a couple who do this every Sunday and have had us over for an awesome homemade Indian feast.
3.) Games / cards night - Euchre for me
4.) Go to yoga class - Feels good physically but also feels good to get out the house and be around people. Or just go to the gym or whatever. YMCA memberships are usually super cheap. Most towns though have a community yoga class that's 5 bucks or less.
5.) Bad TV night - I don't have cable so I go over to a girl friend's house at least once a month to catch up on bad tv together.
I have moved a lot and in my experience things are just about the same wherever I go. Although when I first move somewhere it's usually harder because I have to start from scratch making friends and stuff.
I love the idea of taking a yoga class, because it would probably help my back pain as well. I have two herniated discs and need surgery, but I don't have health insurance.
The trouble is, I don't really have any friends in this town anymore. I had meningitis last year (which caused my spinal issues) and was in the hospital for a long time. It's been a year almost to the day since that happened, and I can count on one hand the number of times I've had any sort of social interaction with a friend. The person I thought was my best friend in Lafayette won't answer my calls or texts. Actually, basically ever since I had my kid (who's 3 now) I've gradually lost friends and, well, it sucks. And like I said, I work 3rd shift, which basically limits my social life 5/7 days of the week to anything before 9:30. Which no one is into.
I have satellite, a nice house, and a nice kitchen. I like the idea of having a potluck or a fancy dinner night, but I don't think anyone here would bother coming. Like I said before, living in a small town like Lafayette, everything revolves around drinking and/or going to bars. Because there's not much else to do. I do know of a community center that offers a cheap yoga class, I think I'm going to sign up.
Bottom line is: I think I need to move. Which sucks, because I grew up here, my whole family is here, and I rely on them for A LOT. Anytime I need a last-minute babysitter I know I can count on my mom, who lives 4 minutes away from me. I don't want to move, really, but I also don't want to spend the rest of my life here as a complete hermit. I'd like to be able to hang out with people who have similar interests as mine who I can listen to records with, but it's just not happening.
Today my husband told me that no one in Lafayette likes me because I come off as "erratic and weird," which I don't think is true. I don't know if he was just trying to fuck with me, but that really stung. I think I'll just quit now, I don't want to be accused (again) of "whining a lot.
*Addendum: I have no desire to drink, so that's not even part of the issue.
Hey Erin, I love you!! Small towns forever! Erratic and weird. Can totally relate. No punks where I'm from. Vancouver Washington.
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I just sent out invitations on Facebook for a Christmas party on the 15th... I hope enough people will come so it's not just 2-3 people hanging out awkwardly. My husband's a chef so he's gonna do all the cooking, and I encouraged people to bring dishes too. I'll be playing records and taking pictures. Hopefully this will work out, I'm kind of excited, I've wanted to throw a Christmas party for years but never got around to it. I'll probably send the kid to my mom's house since he's at the age where he's into everything.
Much thanks to those who gave good ideas.
Tina - I tried looking up local yoga classes online at our community center, but all I could find where ones from the Fall. I guess I'll have to keep looking. There's got to be something out there.
As an aside - another reason I stopped drinking was that alcoholism runs in my mom's side of the family. Her mom is still alive (somehow), and she still drinks a box of wine a day, and smokes. Her husband, who was a fucking anesthesiologist died a very bad, painful death of liver failure in his early 60s.
I don't think my husband was trying to be "mean," he's just not very good at sugar-coating things. Even before he said that I knew I'd fallen out of touch with almost all my friends.
In July of his year I was driving home from my brother's birthday and got pulled over for having a turn signal out. I tested 0.01 above the legal limit and went to jail. That was another reason I quit drinking. Luckily, my step-dad's a lawyer and I didn't get much besides a shit-load of fines and 30 hours of community service. The big deal is, I'm going to have to declare this to the nursing board next October. I won't lose my RN license, but it's made it harder to find jobs. Before that happened, the only trouble I'd ever been in was getting a speeding ticket.
It's just not worth it to be anymore. I have a lot of health problems, and I know alcohol is just going to make them worse. Of course a glass of wine every now and then ain't gonna kill you, but I just have no desire to drink anymore.
My husband is also a severe alcoholic who's in AA, so I feel like a complete hypocrite when I drink.
Meshkalina - Good advice. I'm throwing a Christmas party on the 15th and am planning to make some kind of punch with booze in it. I'm sure no one will come anyway if there isn't alcohol to be had.
Hey,
I went to a Christmas party for the first time last year. It was pretty cool. My friend who I work with threw it at his condo with his boyfriend. My friend / co-worker is 52 (I think) and I think his boyfriend is like 28. He lives on like the 16th floor (top floor) by the Tilikum Crossing in PDX. Killer view! Freezing cold in December! I mostly stood out on the lanai and thought about plunging 16 floors onto the blacktop but didn't follow through. Suicidal / depressed punks forever!
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I should look up AA meetings in Sellwood since I live there. SELLWOOD PUNX! :P I'm just shy/non-talkative so I've never want to go. Thought about it living in Vancouver Washington. I think they used to have them across from Clark College (community college there) but being the only punk / fucking people blasting shit like Crucifix's Dehuminization's LP when school's out and wanting to kill everyone in fucking sight I never fucking done anything there. FUCK MY HOME CITY!!! Vancouver Washington is growing more rapidly than PDX currently but as soon as they have toll bridges so that'll be over. No punk scene to be found. I tried to start one many times. Spend years + a lot of hours doing punk/DIY shit but total fucking failure. In graff/stickers WE RELY!
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I would just accept the fact that after a certain age, most single people are out at bars. The rest are home with their families. I've come to accept that and realize the bars are not for me. There really isn't an in-between in our society. Potlucks and shit like that don't really compare to a drunken punk show with 50-100 people. It's just life.
Suitor, A.A. in the PDX area is probably loaded with cool people. It's a good replacement for your bar friends, and meetings are always good for you if you are trying to get sober. PDX in particular is probably a hard place to stay clean: nine of the ten or so people I know who moved there in this recent wave are alcoholics and wanted to experience the goofy craft beer life. Tons of bars, etc.
Narcotics Annonymous meetings are also amazing. I've never been to a bad one...I do two a week. Really good people (who hang out if you can get into a clique) and the message is very strong. PDX NA meetings are probably filled with interesting characters.
Remember, these are the same people you would have been attracted to approach as a friend at the bar, they are just sober now.
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btw, if the "God thing" bugs you, they have a lot of non-theistic/atheist meetings. I am sure PDX has a ton. I just went to one a week ago; all really cool, open minded people. Google it.
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on the topic of it being a disease...can't remember who said it , but reminds me of some comedian..."the day i'll believe alcohol is a disease, is when i can call my work in the morning, tell em i drank all night, and am still loaded and can't come in - and they'll send me to a hospital, instead of firing my ass!"
Haven't hit a low.
You can drink and then be sober for periods but as the years go on it gets harder to resist saying no. At least that's what I've found. But I also have access to unlimited booze every day. There's 6 bottles sitting 10 feet from me right now. I got into graffiti / stickers when I was sober 'cause I'd go out every day and get exercise to keep from drinking / stay sober. Then I realized you can also get fucked up / listen to music and make stickers as well so I could spend nights making like 100 stickers. I still have a lot and have given them to some people in Portland. Never got a "Thank You" or anything from anyone. It makes you feel shitty for even trying and makes me want to just not connect / talk with anyone and stick to doing my own thing. Moving to a bigger city wasn't a real good idea. There are a lot more people around but it just makes you feel loneliner / more outcast. It is nice to see more graffiti / stickers though. I always try and hit up other sticker people on the street to say "Hi, I say your stuff. I know you exist! Hello!!". :) I plan on biking to downtown PDX today and putting stickers up since it's early morning here and there's not much to do.
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I had to fire a dude I really liked 5-6 years ago because he was caught drinking in his car at lunch time. He was, while young (he was in his late 50s at the time), a Vice President for a company that would at least ring a bell for everyone here. High achiever, incredibly smart and charming when he wanted to be, but also the most cynical person I've ever met, which is probably one reason why we got along. He basically thought every single human was an idiot. He also listened to punk in the 70s and would quote Pistols songs regularly. He knew all the top business folks in the GB area, including ex-Packer Hall of Famers, and seemed to be from a premier local family. I'd wondered why his life had gone to shit personally and professionally (divorce, estranged from all but his mother, OK mid-level jobs but nothing high profile), he hid his drinking pretty well I guess, but it made sense looking back obviously. He went down fighting, but he went down. He was embarassed as hell and I felt bad for him. I told him I wasn't mad and hoped that he'd be OK, but he denied drinking to the end, even though he was seen right outside the HR office by the head HR lady and we saw Hamms (fucking Hamms!) on his front seat of his car. Hamms. Haven't talked to him since, though he left a couple voicemails telling me he could find me an ace job here or there a few years back. Hope he's OK, but I doubt it.
You can still buy Hamms in the Pacific Northwest. It's like the cheapest beer. About $3.98-$4.50 for a 6-pack of tallboys. I used to buy it a lot. Then Winco (local 24-hour supermarket chain) started carrying 18-packs of 12 oz. cans of Rolling Rock for $7.98 so I started drinking that last year. So fucking cheap! Pabst, Rainier, Olympia, Busch, Miller High Life costs more than Hamms / Rolling Rock here by a dollar or two. I used to drink Olde English 800 when Winco carried it in 6-pack of tallboys. Craft beer is good but then you're more into getting drunk than taste profile it gets too fucking expensive. Craft beer 6-packs in the Pacific Northwest is about $7-and-up. I wouldn't consider Henry Weinhards craft but they sell sometimes for like $5.50 a 6-pack of bottles. It's just local beer basically. Nice thing about living in Washington is that there's no deposit fee for cans/bottles. In Oregon it's 10-cents a bottle. An 18-pack will be $1.80 on top of what you're paying already. :(
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https://www.facebook.com/this12steplife/
No new episode of Jack Grisham's 12 Step Life this week. >:( Fucking bummed out! He's on tour though, so..
I still like this, very funny:
Jack G. - AA Speaker - Alcoholics Anonymous Speaker
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJv8aslzJ0Y
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Both these movies are good. You can ask your local library (usually online) to order them if you want to see them. Totally worth it! :)
Bill W.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJv8aslzJ0Y
My Name Is Bill W.
Can't find a trailer for this one!
Here's the full Lois Wilson movie starring Winona Ryder-
When Love Is Not Enough: The Lois Wilson Story
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cx5eu_yDI4k
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I didn't know they made a movie about Lois. I always thought she didn't get enough credit in the A.A. world: if it wasn't for her supporting Bill all those years, he would have died/gone nuts and A.A. would never exist. She also had a lot to do with the "To Wives" section of The Big Book.
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Hey man if you're really feeling like you can't be around people who drink then don't. Its all about self control.
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i cant control my alcohol intake so i quit drinking. i never wanted to preach to anyone or tell people what they could or couldnt do, but i quickly found that i was not comfortable being around people who were drinking. so i quit hanging out with those people. i quit my job, i got a job where nobody drank, at a nursing home. i didnt quit the band, but i cancelled a bunch of gigs and a tour, and i stopped booking new gigs.
i found that i was not any happier staying away from people who were drinking. the longer i had been alcohol free, the more comfortable i became hanging around people who were drinking. i quit my job again, i started booking more gigs.
where i am at now, i dont mind hanging out with people who are drinking, but i dont like doing it every day. even once a week is too much, on average. but i found a healthy middle point, where i can still go to shows in bars, hang out with friends, and have a good time.
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Haven't hit a low.
You can drink and then be sober for periods but as the years go on it gets harder to resist saying no. At least that's what I've found. But I also have access to unlimited booze every day. There's 6 bottles sitting 10 feet from me right now. I got into graffiti / stickers when I was sober 'cause I'd go out every day and get exercise to keep from drinking / stay sober. Then I realized you can also get fucked up / listen to music and make stickers as well so I could spend nights making like 100 stickers. I still have a lot and have given them to some people in Portland. Never got a "Thank You" or anything from anyone. It makes you feel shitty for even trying and makes me want to just not connect / talk with anyone and stick to doing my own thing. Moving to a bigger city wasn't a real good idea. There are a lot more people around but it just makes you feel loneliner / more outcast. It is nice to see more graffiti / stickers though. I always try and hit up other sticker people on the street to say "Hi, I say your stuff. I know you exist! Hello!!". :) I plan on biking to downtown PDX today and putting stickers up since it's early morning here and there's not much to do.
Not sure why you quoted me on this one, but I'll jump back in the conversation.
Three and a half years not getting drunk for me. I have a beer with dinner once in a rare while (like a couple times a year), but that's it. I could always handle one or two beers, but after that I probably wasn't gonna be stopping for a good 12-24 hours.
It may have been different for me compared to most, but I found quitting to be easy. I'd really only drink when I was going out, mainly at shows. So, I didn't have any sort of physical withdrawal. Going out knowing I wasn't gonna get trashed was the hard part.
I really disliked it at first, and honestly, I still ain't crazy about it. But it feels like less of a big deal as time goes on. The older I get, the more drunk people annoy me. Idiots who won't shut the fuck up and have no concept of personal space. People that hang out at bars all the time getting wasted every night...fucking boring. Used to be bummed that I didn't go to as many shows as I used to...then I started going out to em sober...and realizing most of em weren't all that great anyhow, and that social interactions in bars are mostly superficial.
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I just hit my 2-year mark in February. I never had a problem NOT having alcohol on any given day, but once I had a beer or two, it was game over. I was going for blackout. Usually by myself, too (if I was lucky and not in public).
So, I didn't struggle with abstaining, but I have struggled with things like leading a life without that as a crutch for doing certain things. Especially art and how to fill time. I won't get into it too much, but I've realized it's very possible to quit and have underlying problems with quitting that you're unaware of.
Socializing is hard enough in this era of technology, but everyone is right that it's much harder when you aren't drinking. Unless you're wired to be a prime socialite, which I am... not. But I still love hanging out with a good homie one-on-one, even though I despise hanging with large groups even more now that I'm sober.
Oh and weed.
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No drunk. Go to work. Still got 500-600 things up so far this week. I'm really lazy except for a few things I like and don't even fucking know how I got so much shit up. Still feels like it's never enough / never satisfied. I've hit spots and realize I've already got shit up there rocking from like 3-4 months ago :P
Yep. Stay busy. Good way to stay sober.
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Drunk til die. Fuck! Couldn't even sleep last night. Been up 24 hours up. Nothing to do. Drinking. I was gonna put up stickers (already completely bombed the fucking route I'd take to downtown PDX) + too early. Listened to so much shit. Hard to find good bands! Looking at old posts here. Such boring stuff. Old punk is basically "dad rock". Brainbombs are SO GOOD! I LIKE THESE ALBUMS!! SO BORING!! Give me new shit, tough shit, painful shit, stuff with feeling, not that OLD SHIT!! Got to find your own shitty music these daze.
Shit posts.
Look Stupid.
Drunk
Stupid
Punks.
!
X
CLAM
AT
SHUN
POINT
-->
!!
Z
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WE AREN'T ALL HAVING PROBLEMS
WITH
AL.CO.HOL
YOU ARE.
:P
GOT WATER
?
:-X
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*PARCHED PUNX*
Punks looks stupid spelled with an X, I only spell it with an S. :-[
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New 12 Step Life with Jack Grisham! He's back from tour! :)
https://www.facebook.com/this12steplife/videos/432039140558462/
"Judge, Have pity on me... I'm an orphan."
"I shoved a pound of cocaine up my ass before 7 AM.".. 8)
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Jack back!
4.22.2018 episode!
https://www.facebook.com/this12steplife/videos/440118843083825/
Watching drinking Balboa and Grateful Red wine. I'm bad. I did give a couple of my co-workers 4 bottles of wine last night at work. Could've taken them home but chose to be nice and give them away and make someone's night with a kind gesture. One of co-workers I gave them to has a tattoo of pepperoni pizza with cheese dripping off. Why do modern people think pizza, hot dogs, hamburgers etc somehow have something to do with rebellion? I like the hardcore black&white punk stuff with something to say. Anything that mixes food and punk is going to be lame. Rebellion nothing. Just stupid copying shit to be "cute". Very boring / stand for zero. It's like punk bands who sing about soda or beer or getting drunk. Really boring topic to make music about.
Mean Jeans: Totinos (Portland Oregon, 2017)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9rPau4Gcw4A
So fucking cringeworthy. Make Portland look stupid and like shit. Why sell shitty product? At least sell something that's actually good or worthwhile.
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singing about getting drunk is like singing about hating school, its cool if you're 17, not so much if you're 40.
i'm alcohol free for over 3 1/2 years. weigh less than 200 lbs for the first time since high school. off all meds.
enjoy going to shows more than ever. feeling better about myself and more together than ever before.
wish i coulda quit sooner. glad i didnt wait until i was 40 to quit. i feel like as you get older, the damage you do to yourself increases exponentially.
was talking to a friend the other night about folks who do hard drugs. that shit isnt cool when youre young, but its especially sad when youre old. seeing some 50 year olds partying hard, slamming shots, snorting lines, whatever. its just sad, really.
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"Why do modern people think pizza, hot dogs, hamburgers etc somehow have something to do with rebellion?"
This hipster ex of mine who lives in NYC now is all about this: she has a pizza tat I think. She also does these weird collages of wine and pizza...burgers...it's a thing.
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http://rebloggy.com/post/gif-kitty-cute-food-party-weird-funny-gif-hipster-awesome-galaxy-dj-pizza-yummy/85677918346
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I gave up drinking. I guess it's been 3 days now. I've never been one to keep dates, days, hours, minutes. It's not that it's ever been hard to quit, it's always just that I've lived down the road from stores or pass places and had easy access. It's weird to not live down the street from a supermarket anymore. When you live down from a places that sells cheap booze it's hard to resist. I'd pass the market almost every day or sometimes multiple times a day. So hard to get away from. Now in PDX I don't even need to pay money and can get fucked up every day of the week.
Being shy / having no one to talk to / social anxiety / never fitting in / living in the suburbs / etc. life has been sort of boring mostly and drinking's been a way to fill the time when you have no one to talk to or feel depressed / suicidal.
I've always felt alcohol makes listening to music about 1000x better. That's the thing I hate about being sober. I've never really been in agreement with people that sober life is great or life gets a lot better. It's just more about not dying and letting family members down. I've always been a loner so it's not like anyone was ever calling me more to do stuff or I was going out more. Life was just the same except I was sober.
Never been a loner because I liked it. Just shy / unskilled at talking to people. Always wanted cool friends / people to talk with / listen to music or friends that could give me music recommendations with but no one around.
A lot of people with social anxiety actually crave friendship but don't know how to talk to people and make friends. That's always been the boat I've been in. Very hard to deal with and look back on over the years about things you've missed out on if you wouldn't taken a chance :'( I'm trying to do stuff not and make up for past lost years.
I also have lost people I love which makes it hard to talk to people. It's weird to ask people if their families are still alive and for them to say yes. A lot of times I've felt like I can't connect with those people and it's weird that their families are alive and mine is not. I do feel like I can connect / talk with people that have lost people though as there is a shared connection there. I've quit asking people if their families are still alive. I'd rather not know at this point and not be against someone/jealous for no reason other than anger/resentment that their family is still alive and mine is not. It's hard to deal with that and knowing you're the next in line in your family to die.
Downtime also is a killer when you are sober. How do you fill your downtime? You used to drink to pass the time. What do you do now. That is the question!
Wish more shows were all ages. Seems like every show here is 21+ and involves being around people who are drinking. I know you can get non-alcoholic shit but it's still weird being around a bunch of people with beers or having people ask you what you want to drink. I feel weird asking for non-alcoholic stuff. Almost like I'm not wanted.
Going to a show on May 3rd. 21+. What a shocker ::) I want to go to more shows but a lot of stuff seems pretty uninteresting when I look up local shows/local bands. I don't have the ability to look up 30/40 bands everyday for what might potentially be cool, so maybe I'm missing out on cool stuff. I really don't know. Love hardcore and most standard sort of punk but I if I'm going to spend money I want to go to stuff outside of my normal punk-taste comfort zone and try something new or more experimental. Even if I don't like it! I don't know if that rings true with anyone but I don't want the standard same ol' punk shit. I like the bands but don't have a ton of interest in seeing shit that seems like is hasn't changed/progressed or refuses to from years past. This includes most stuff: garage, oi!, street punk, '77, power pop, hardcore, straight edge, etc. Some people just seem to stay the same and some change or get more interested in other shit?
Might write more tomorrow. Don't know. Hope you are well :)
P.S.
We are in this together and I LOVE YOU.
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Dude, maybe you should find a therapist or start a blog.
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Suitor I live in Portland too and don't like drinking at shows. If you ever see a stocky kid with a Mercyful Fate backpatch you can come talk to me. I'm quite awful at human interaction too.
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BAM! Fellowship.
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Suitor, did you play in Therapists?
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Suitor, did you play in Therapists?
To clarify, not trying to troll/harass/bring unwanted attention with this question - I'm legitimately curious.
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Suitor I live in Portland too and don't like drinking at shows. If you ever see a stocky kid with a Mercyful Fate backpatch you can come talk to me. I'm quite awful at human interaction too.
This makes my day. Way to reach out, dude!
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I played Mario Kart online today and one of them was "BradX" from the USA, was it you officer??
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nope. i havent been doing much gaming lately, though i did get my basement MAME cab working again in recent weeks. kind of a nice stormy/humid night tonight, thinking i might pop the garage door and play some late night donkey kong. like i used to do in the old days when i was a drinker, this would have been an ice cold beer in the garage kind of night, nowadays i drink generic gatorade, LOL.
i do alot of cemetery walking too. maybe its easier for me, because i was an only child who grew up in an abusive household, but i dont mind solitude. my social interactions that dont involve alcohol are work and time i spend with my wife. i am also in two bands and those are social interactions which do involve alcohol, i just dont drink anymore.
music sounds better when youre drunk is bullshit. things are more fun when youre drunk is bullshit. i have more fun going out and doing things now than i ever did, because my life isnt tied to an addiction anymore. when i am playing, its about playing, not the party. thusly, my playing has improved. when i go to a show, its not to party. its because i want to see and hear live music, or i want to spend time with friends. my motivation is different, my perception is different. i feel strong and in control, not like i need to have a drink in my hand just to be comfortable.
the drink is just a drink.